not only did it start in 92........

but

93
94
95
96
97

would be 5 years anyway, so he is wrong no matter how you look at that statement :shock:

those early bastards of an lt1 car don't count. :lol:

hehe high 12's :wink: stock :wink:

not all of them, so dont claim it

I don't even know where to start telling you how wrong you are. Just because magazines and message boards are showing a lot of gen III transplant stuff that doesn't mean it is anywhere close to pushing out the gen I. The gen III is certainly popular but it's nowhere near as popular as the gen I. The I had such a long production run and there are so many millions of them out there I don't even think the gen III has anything close to a legitimate run at the #1 title. Too few of them have been produced so far.

I think one of the driving factors pushing the Gen I out the door is not anything attractive about the Gen II or Gen III, it's the PITA that is ZDDP.

True, step away from the net, LS1tech and magazines and walk outside into the real world. Walk around the car shows and cruise nights. Not that many transplants in real life. The death of the SBC and BBC is greatly exaggerated.

BTW, the LS1 has been out of production for what, 6 years?

The gen III/IV architecture is very nice, it’s a great engine. But remember there are many nice BBC cars will still stomp most LS based cars. Along with a lot of other cars & engines. There are always faster cars out there. Broaden your horizons, don’t be a single model snob.

very true guys, you only see what you want to see.

The LS1 will probably end up the same fate as all past engines when GM does some new design and uses a new designation code. Then everyone with those engines will look down on the LS1 like the LS1 guys try to do to the LT1w. Which I always found odd, The TPI cars never bashed the carbed guys, or the LT1 guys never bashed the PTI guys. Guess the LS1 are a different breed?

Few years back there was some secret ceramic / polymer engine that was 1/3 the weight of metal and because the material it required no internal oiling system. With ultra light weight parts and no heat issues the engine had outstanding performance potential. I'm amazed it hasn't made it into the public yet, but gas prices probably are keeping electric cars a more popular option for selling new cars.

As far as old school going away, don't think so. Way too many people still love a good old 350 engine, go to any drag strip or cruise night and count the carb'd SB and BB cars and compare them to the LT or LS cars. Other then these message boards the old school still rules! Even on here, look at the fastest cars, JS, Bad434 and what are their setups?

not at all its still an lsx based engine

93's are supposedly one of the fastest years...think it has something to do w/ the different gear syncros for 93.

Anything thats not a 95 LT1 suck.

uh, what?
While I never bashed the carb guys, LT1 and LS1 guys look down on the TPI guys big time.
I dont think that people will look down on the 4th gens, even if the car will be marginally faster. Im sure there will be some people, but I think that the fifth gen could unite the gens!!
Combo of old and new. Could be nice.

Nothing will ever beat the Gen 1 small block.
LS1 stuff affordable? Anyone know where I can get a set of new heads for 400 bucks and make a bunch of power for an LS1

Eh, Al your thinking of us new kids with LT1s/LS1s.

You can get a set of LS6 243 heads "new" for that price.(Just pulled off of a low mileage car). They are a descent amount better than the 806, 853, and 241's that all 4th gens came with.

eh..no.
Since the first day I went on line, went to a car meet, went anywhere with my 87, I got the ol look down the nose.
Was it cause I drove a third gen? Was it cause it was a 305?
TPI guys get more respect over LG4/L69/L03 cars. The general distaste for third gens is upsetting.

First off, its used. Low milage is still not new.

I could pull off a set of Vortec heads from some truck for 300. Hell, Ian was selling worked Vortec heads for that much!

LS1 parts are no where near "cheap". When cams and lifters cost under 150 bucks, when headers cost under 300 bucks coated, etc etc...you get the point.
LS1's are not nearly as affordable as SBC's. SBC will continue to be the king engine.

hah... o dont take it so serisously... this is all in good fun... and if anybody honesestly is going to look down on sombody becuase of what engine is in the f-body... then they are not worthy of being a car guy... if everybody owned a 2002 trans am or SS the meets would be pretty boring... but look at the shore meets alone... we got a TPI camaro, LT1 firebird and camaro... LS1 trans am... that are the usualls... imean nice variety... BTW... if you really think hard... any fbody that is probably runnign a GEN 1 block is probably a little out of most of the peoples price range and or mechanical ability... right away a decent driver 1st gen is going to run you at least $20grand an early 2nd will probably run you $10-15grand.... i mean sure you can buy a 79 camaro rust bucket...but who wants to drive that around and if they dont have the money or know how to fix her up then its a waste... so they just buy a more affordable nice looking lt1 car or thirdgen... theres more too it than just hear-say... oh and btw while i own and lt1 car and plan on keeping it that way... i mean there is a reason the ls based engines have better stats... umm they are newer technology.... its evolution...

True. I wasn't trying to say that LS1>SBC. The SBC will always be around because of how long it has been around and is a proven platform. Now on the other hand, that Gen III and up is all pretty much based off of the LS1. The way I look at it, if your building an old hot rod and don't want a carb set up, your going to end up with an LSx setup.

even though I am an LS1 guy, I must agree, they are very expensive to mod. BigAl has many good point, and I can see what he means.

dustin found his ls1 block with 40k miles on it for 500 bucks, a set of ls6 heads ported and polished with double springs for like 700 and the rest for not much more. thats gen 1 prices for new school power.




i said the ls1 is slowly pushing the older motors out, and its true. once all you old farts with your dinosaurs die then we can finally put the gen 1's and 2's to the moooozaaaaams where they belong

LS1 is a museum piece with the new 5th gen coming out. Hate to break it to the LS1 nuthuggers but your hey day is over.

yeah because theres a big difference between an ls1 and ls3? pfffff. theyre still based on the same design.




the 5th gen is gonna be an utter fail and will be on sale for under 20k in the next year or so just like its little brother the gto

For used parts, you could do that or cheaper used for SBC. You can find a used running roller motor & used canfields or something for that money and keep up with that setup.

And for retrofits the cost goes up a lot. Fuel system, headers, mounts, intake setups, wiring & programming, oil pans, accessory systems, cooling, etc. If you already have a BBC or SBC setup in the car retrofitting is much more $$. At least old cars usually come with rears that can handle more than 100 HP. :rofl:

Let me know when your or dustins car can outrun any of the dinosaur powered cars Josh runs. Or simply stay together and run for 90 straight days. :lol:

ouch :nod:

Let me ask you this...do Josh's cars run on pump gas or race gas? If it's race gas, your argument is null and void. There are plenty head/cam cars running 10's on pump gas, which I don't consider that bad. And to add heat to the fire.... There was recently an auto Z06 running 8.80s on pump gas and full weight.<---this car is still LSx based so it is fair to compare to josh's cars.

Btw, Zo6> the square box they call a turd gen

:fight:

In the end, the SBC>LSx based cars right now, but that doesn't mean that they aren't becoming more popular.