something to think about...

[jims69camaro]

on the eve of the killing of the man who said, "All we need is love", i got this email:

Originally Posted by Ben Stein

The following was written by Ben Stein and recited by him on CBS Sunday Morning


Commentary.

My confession:

I am a Jew, and every single one of my ancestors was Jewish. And it does not bother me even a little bit when people call those beautiful lit up, bejeweled trees, Christmas trees.. I don't feel threatened. I don't feel discriminated against. That's what they are: Christmas trees.

It doesn't bother me a bit when people say, 'Merry Christmas' to me. I don't think they are slighting me or getting ready to put me in a ghetto. In fact, I kind of like it It shows that we are all brothers and sisters celebrating this happy time of year. It doesn't bother me at all that there is a manger scene on display at a key intersection near my beach house in Malibu . If people want a Christmas Tree, it's just as fine with me as is the Menorah a few hundred yards away.

I don't like getting pushed around for being a Jew, and I don't think Christians like getting pushed around for being Christians. I think people who believe in God are sick and tired of getting pushed around, period. I have no idea where the concept came from that America is an explicitly atheist country. I can't find it in the Constitution and I don't like it being shoved down my throat.

Or maybe I can put it another way: where did the idea come from that we should worship celebrities and we aren't allowed to worship God as we understand Him? I guess that's a sign that I'm getting old, too. But there are a lot of us who are wondering where these celebrities came from and where the America we knew went to.

In light of the many jokes we send to one another for a laugh, this is a little different: This is not intended to be a joke; it's not funny, it's intended to get you thinking.

Billy Graham's daughter was interviewed on the Early Show and Jane Clayson asked her 'How could God let something like this happen?' (regarding Katrina) Anne Graham gave an extremely profound and insightful response. She said, 'I believe God is deeply saddened by this, just as we are, but for years we've been telling God to get out of our schools, to get out of our government and to get out of our lives. And being the gentleman He is, I believe He has calmly backed out. How can we expect God to give us His blessing and His protection if we demand He leave us alone?'


In light of recent events... terrorists attack, school shootings, etc. I think it started when Madeleine Murray O'Hare (she was murdered, her body found a few years ago) complained she didn't want prayer in our schools, and we said OK. Then someone said you better not read the Bible in school. The Bible says thou shalt not kill, thou shalt not steal, and love your neighbor as yourself. And we said OK.

Then Dr. Benjamin Spock said we shouldn't spank our children when they misbehave because their little personalities would be warped and we might damage their self-esteem ( D r Spock's son committed suicide). We said an expert should know what he's talking about. And we said OK.

Now we're asking ourselves why our children have no conscience, why they don't know right from wrong, and why it doesn't bother them to kill strangers, their classmates, and
themselves.

Probably, if we think about it long and hard enough, we can figure it out. I think it has a great deal to do with 'WE REAP WHAT WE SOW.'

Funny how simple it is for people to trash God and then wonder why the world's going to hell Funny how we believe what the newspapers say, but question what the Bible says. Funny how you can send 'jokes' through e-mail and they spread like wildfire but when you start sending messages regarding the Lord, people think twice about sharing. Funny how lewd, crude, vulgar and obscene articles pass freely through cyberspace, but public discussion of God is suppressed in the school and workplace.

Are you laughing yet?

Funny how when you forward this message, you will not send it to many on


your address list because you're not sure what they believe, or what they


will think of you for sending it.


Funny how we can be more worried about what other people think of us than what God thinks of us.

Pass it on if you think it has merit. If not then just discard it... no one will know you did. But, if you discard this thought process, don't sit back and complain about what bad shape the world is in.



My Best Regards, Honestly and respectfully,


Ben Stein

hits home, doesn't it?

[Knipps]

http://www.snopes.com/politics/soapbox/confessions.asp

It was written by him but there were some additions made over the years.

[LTb1ow]

Not really. Attributing the way things are to the removal of God from mainstream society seems kinda far fetched.

[sweetbmxrider]

eh, it makes you think. more-so how we are so absorbed by celebs and crap. some is far fetched though. some i can see.

[LTb1ow]

Thinking beyond what will give yourself immediate pleasure would solve a lot of problems. And people accepting responsibly for what they do. God is a crutch. You can use a lot of other ways to teach good ideals and morals to people.

[NJSPEEDER]

I think it is more about the sentiment that every traditional forum for teaching youth structure and respect has been cut down. In public schools in this country you are not allowed to even mention God in any form as a teacher, but why? If you look throughout history, many of the greatest and worst moments in history have been somehow related to or based on faith.

I do not think that prayer should be in school as a requirement, but having classes or discussions of religion in other classes when appropriate is logical and consistent with the concept of offering a complete education.

Public education, like so many other things, has spent more and more time over the years playing to the minority instead of the majority. It would be so easy to teach kids right and wrong based on history and faith while be inclusive of all faiths. After all, once broken down, the basis of nearly every faith on the planet is simply teaching people to be nice to each other.

[LTb1ow]

I will prob get laughed at for it, but the boyscouts had no real ties to any "religion" and they can and still do impart responsibility and self reliance to kids. Why can't schools do that? Why does society have an obsession with getting rich quick like every other retarded celeb?

[sweetbmxrider]

catholic school boy scouts had religion tied in

[NJSPEEDER]

Because kids are taught nothing in school. If you can handle the basics of memorizing things long enough to pass a test and how to logically deduce answers on a standardized test you have it made.

That really has nothing to do with religion to me, but more to the fact that kids are not taught application or consequences. There is no reason that everyone shoudl get a trophy just for showing up or make the honor roll because they got all A's in a class that is grade levels below their age.

I place that blame solely on the people who decided that there is such a thing as good enough. Good enough stops working once you get out of school, so why is it taught in school?

[LTb1ow]

Catholic school boy scouts? wth?
And boyscouts just require "some" sort of religion... its more of a personal thing.
Not that I was a boyscout or anything.....

[LTb1ow]

Originally Posted by NJSPEEDER

Because kids are taught nothing in school. If you can handle the basics of memorizing things long enough to pass a test and how to logically deduce answers on a standardized test you have it made.

That really has nothing to do with religion to me, but more to the fact that kids are not taught application or consequences. There is no reason that everyone shoudl get a trophy just for showing up or make the honor roll because they got all A's in a class that is grade levels below their age.

I place that blame solely on the people who decided that there is such a thing as good enough. Good enough stops working once you get out of school, so why is it taught in school?

Agreed. I always thought it was funny for a teacher to just teach what was nesacery to pass the test.

[sweetbmxrider]

i went to catholic school and boy scouts was tied into it. run by the parents and whatever.

i have to admit, highschool was the biggest joke and prepared me for nothing.

[Blacdout96]

Nope, doesnt get me thinking. I got more important things to worry about then some person, who've Ive never met, I call my creator, I know who my creator is, im still iving with them. Now's the time to live, when the afterlife comes ( Then again I dont believe in religion, and if I did, the only thing I would believe in is reincarnation) Then is the time to say thank you. I say this, there are two things in this world you should never talk about publicly, cause it never ends well, and that politics and religion.

[LTb1ow]

Nah, I think religion can be discussed civilly. Its not just about telling someone that they are going to hell or that their god is made by man. Its a lot deeper than that.

[Blacdout96]

And as for boy scouts, yeah catholic is tied in it, also there is a Christian based boy scouts called the Royal Rangers. I used to be in it, pinewood derby and all, same thing ,different name.

[Knipps]

Religion is tied into boy scouts. Kind of.
does this line ring a bell?
"...to God and my country.."

Honestly I don't think it's the school's responsibility to teach right and wrong. If we're to learn everything in school what responsibility do the parents have?

[LTb1ow]

Well I think parents should be involved in their kids schooling so its a group effort.

[LTb1ow]

Originally Posted by Knipps

Religion is tied into boy scouts. Kind of.
does this line ring a bell?
"...to God and my country.."

Honestly I don't think it's the school's responsibility to teach right and wrong. If we're to learn everything in school what responsibility do the parents have?

And that was three years of heavy drinking ago, I don't remeber everything....

[sweetbmxrider]

i was just saying my catholic school had boyscouts and they tied religion in some. damn.

[LTb1ow]

Well I think we all agree that religion is overrated. Sorry Mr Jim. I guess we are products of a atheist society.
But I don't think any of us go out and hurt/maim/kill people?

[NJSPEEDER]

Originally Posted by Shownomercy

Agreed. I always thought it was funny for a teacher to just teach what was nesacery to pass the test.

It is because that is what they are allowed to teach. Over the years, curriculum has been taken out of the hands of educators and put under the per view of politicians. The only measure of smart and dumb they can understand is a number on a test that they most likely don't understand. Makes for a pretty sad standard if you ask me.

Think of it this way, in the 1950's almost every school board in the country was made up of teachers and curriculum was made by each individual teacher to achieve certain goals by years end, at that time almost every American home received and read a newspaper every day. The good was that more people who could read would do so actively, the bad was that because of the lack of national or even regional standards, a lower percentage of people were in the position to learn to read well.

Flash forward to the present, we have many times more educational opportunities, the percentage of money spent on education per person has gone up dramatically, and yet the same very low percentage of the population can read at or above a 3rd grade level.

The average college graduate in the US doesn't even read on what is considered a high school level, the average newspaper article is written on a 2nd grade level, and even periodicals considered "smart" like the Wall Street Journal only average a 5th grade level.

It is a shocking failure of the system. You don't even want to get me started on math skills in this country, math teaches deduction and logic, concepts so few people can actually handle that is disgusts me.

[Blacdout96]

Originally Posted by Knipps

Religion is tied into boy scouts. Kind of.
does this line ring a bell?
"...to God and my country.."

Honestly I don't think it's the school's responsibility to teach right and wrong. If we're to learn everything in school what responsibility do the parents have?

I do have to agree with Tim that the schools aren't teaching us properly. I had a girlfriend who was in the top 50 of her class, real smart and all, but was BOOK smart. There were alot of things outside the school walls I had to teach her. I would tell her the consequences of things, and, well she learned the hard way. Schools should make an effort to show right and wrong, beyond in school and out of school suspensions, blah blah blah, I see kids all the time coming out of school and just being plain bad, they have no sense of decency, or direction in life. Parents play a major role in this as well, but if the parents are no good, wheres the kid gonna learn right form wrong from.

[NJSPEEDER]

Originally Posted by Shownomercy

Well I think we all agree that religion is overrated. Sorry Mr Jim. I guess we are products of a atheist society.
But I don't think any of us go out and hurt/maim/kill people?

Do you think it is religion or faith that is over rated?

I see faith and religion as separate concepts. Religion is merely a structure of faith, with general guidelines or guiding concepts. Faith itself is something that we all have to some degree, faith the sun will come up tomorrow, faith that my car won't get stolen out of my driveway, faith that I can fart and have it stink enough to drive people out of a room.

There is a division as I see it, religious faith is individual, but faith in general seems vastly more common.

[LTb1ow]

Originally Posted by NJSPEEDER

It is because that is what they are allowed to teach. Over the years, curriculum has been taken out of the hands of educators and put under the per view of politicians. The only measure of smart and dumb they can understand is a number on a test that they most likely don't understand. Makes for a pretty sad standard if you ask me.

Think of it this way, in the 1950's almost every school board in the country was made up of teachers and curriculum was made by each individual teacher to achieve certain goals by years end, at that time almost every American home received and read a newspaper every day. The good was that more people who could read would do so actively, the bad was that because of the lack of national or even regional standards, a lower percentage of people were in the position to learn to read well.

Flash forward to the present, we have many times more educational opportunities, the percentage of money spent on education per person has gone up dramatically, and yet the same very low percentage of the population can read at or above a 3rd grade level.

The average college graduate in the US doesn't even read on what is considered a high school level, the average newspaper article is written on a 2nd grade level, and even periodicals considered "smart" like the Wall Street Journal only average a 5th grade level.

It is a shocking failure of the system. You don't even want to get me started on math skills in this country, math teaches deduction and logic, concepts so few people can actually handle that is disgusts me.

Well put. And Diffi Q's next semester woot!

[Knipps]

I have met way too many people who are book smart but when it comes to common sense and logic people are dumb as a stone. I was raised in a real Old-School type family. My dad was born in the 40s and my mom was raised in Outback Australia, no nonsense.

You can't teach common sense. But then again it's not so common anymore