Multiple starting problems - NJFBOA - Home of New Jersey's Camaros and Firebirds

vipergtx500 · 10-03-2010, 04:57 AM

Here's my new peculiar problem(s). A few nights ago it rained all day, I had class for a few hours and when I came back to leave my car wouldn't start, the starter wouldn't engage, nothing happened when I turned the key. I ended up getting a push and popping the clutch and it was fine. Next day I was gonna look at the starter because for the past 2 months it's been making a mechanical grinding sound when the car initial starts up. So the next morning I just try and start the car for ****s and giggles and it starts. great. I inspect the starter and externally it looks fine.

So today I go to leave work and it takes a little longer to start, when it did, it ran for about 10 sec and then shut off and the check gauges light came on. All the gauges were fine. The car wouldn't turn over now, so I get a push, nothing, but i realize my fuel pump isn't priming. As I'm getting pushed into the parking space I hear it prime so I immediately turn the key and it starts right up.

These two problems seem mechanically unrelated, so I'm thinking it might be an electrical issue? All opinions on what's wrong with this thing would be greatly appreciated. Thanx

sweetbmxrider · 10-03-2010, 10:31 AM

well if your car stalled, it would go into bulb test so all of the dash lights would come on. i would jack the car up and check for power at the small terminal on the starter when someone turns the key to run. keep doing it till the car doesn't start and have them hold the key in the start position. if you show power on the small wire, i would replace the starter.

as for the fuel pump issue, same thing. the harness comes through the body where the back seats are. the gray wire supplies power to the pump. when you hear the pump not prime, check for power on that wire. if it has power, i'd recommend a fuel pump. note that with the key on engine off, the fuel pump is turned on for a couple seconds then turned off for several. your best bet would be to have someone continuously cycle the key from off to on while you probe the wire.

let me know if you need clarification.

JL8Jeff · 10-03-2010, 11:31 AM

Check the battery cable connections at the battery. That sounds similar to when the battery post rotted out of my battery on my 2000 SS. The Delco side post batteries have this issue.

vipergtx500 · 10-08-2010, 03:23 PM

Thanks for the input guys, I've been swamped all week so I haven't got to look at the connections at the starter/fuel pump. The car hasn't given me a starting problem since, I even tested it in the middle of the night when it's cold after sitting all day. I am going to inspect the battery this afternoon. Another random thing, the TCS OFF and ABS INOP lights come on once in a blue moon and usually in the same day turn off. Probably a wheel sensor or something but I thought I'd share because it's electronics related. Also, since the first problem, I have to turn my lights on off and then on again for them to come up. This car is really messing with me.

sweetbmxrider · 10-08-2010, 03:27 PM

definitely take off both connections and thoroughly check for corrosion. check your main grounds and power connections for tightness as well.

vipergtx500 · 10-08-2010, 04:53 PM

Checked both connections, a little acid build up on the positive terminal but nothing too serious, just now I was driving and the car died twice at an intersection, managed to restart it and park. It started and ran fine in the parking space. Gonna have to wait until after the rutgers game to attempt to leave, too much traffic. No check engine light.

WildBillyT · 10-08-2010, 05:00 PM

Remember, if you are in a pinch you can push start your car...

spina74 · 10-08-2010, 11:40 PM

I had a very similiar issue, my ignition switch and switch pigtail got fried some how, and the car would either lose power completely then regain it or I would have power and no fuel pump.

vipergtx500 · 10-09-2010, 03:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WildBillyT

Remember, if you are in a pinch you can push start your car...

thanks lol but that's one feature that I know pretty well. Popping the clutch has gotten me out of a lot of sticky situations.

Quote:

Originally Posted by spina74

I had a very similiar issue, my ignition switch and switch pigtail got fried some how, and the car would either lose power completely then regain it or I would have power and no fuel pump.

This is very interesting, is this the switch and did you replace both it and the pigtail?

spina74 · 10-11-2010, 10:29 PM

yea, I replaced both, the pigtail was fried to where the plastic was black and charred

MyFirstZ · 10-11-2010, 11:37 PM

check the resistance on the ground side of the fuel pump. . . from the connector to chassis ground. If you can find out where it grounds to.

the starter isnt gonig to cause your car to stall so i would almost rule that out, unless this is a bad coincidence

the only thing that is bugging me is that you said it will do nothing sometimes when you try and crank it. Ah i cant think right now. . . i usualy think of everything on my way home from work and have to wait till i get back in the morning to try it.

vipergtx500 · 10-12-2010, 11:21 AM

Dropped the steering column yesterday, both my blue and black ignition switch pigtail connectors look perfectly fine, im going to drop it more and replace the switch. If that doesn't work ill check the ground at the fuel pump. Is it possible the switch is bad even though the connectors looked fine?

MyFirstZ · 10-12-2010, 07:24 PM

it could be, there are ways to test it. . .you just need to know waht wire is what

if the part is cheap enough and you got it apart i guess get another one but it might not do anything. . . .

vipergtx500 · 10-12-2010, 09:43 PM

the part was only $18 so i replaced it. Let it idle for about 20min with no problems. Going to drive it around a little tomorrow and see what happens.

vipergtx500 · 10-14-2010, 01:24 PM

Started it this morning after sitting all night. Started and died, kinda sputtered after for a second. Wouldn't start back up right away. Eventually started, SES was on with code P0372 - Timing Reference High Resolution Signal A Too Few Pulses. This code came about when I originally got the car and had to replace the opti... I just replaced it for the 2nd time in June with an AC Delco. If it is the opti, how does that explain the fuel pump not priming that one instance? This code also will be triggered if the circuit is grounded or open.

MyFirstZ · 10-14-2010, 11:26 PM

opti > me

lol, cant really help you out much there.

vipergtx500 · 10-15-2010, 01:43 PM

ok, deducing that it's the fuel pump related. Went to start it last night just to check and it wouldn't start, fuel pump took long to prime, then it started and sputtered until it died seconds later. After that when the key was in the on position the fuel pump would prime multiple times in a row. Got it to start with pedal to the floor but of course it just died. No codes were thrown. Going to get a fuel pressure gauge and check the pressure. I'll swap the fuel pump relay and check the regulator as well and report back.

MyFirstZ · 10-16-2010, 10:12 PM

well if it isnt priming of course there is going to be no pressure. . . . It probably is just a faulty fuel pump but there are quick checks to make just to verify it before you spend the money in parts and labor if you dont do it yourself

vipergtx500 · 10-18-2010, 03:53 PM

ok so checked fuel pressure and it's at a solid 40psi when the key is in the on position. The thing that keeps cycling wasn't the fuel pump, it was the AIR pump, I couldn't tell form inside the car but I had a friend turn the key this time so it was clear what it was. It seems to me that it could be an electrical problem of some sort because something keeps cycling. I pulled the AIR relay but there still is something that keeps cycling I have no clue what it is. Also, there is a loud metallic clunk sound similar to dropping a coin in a meter which only occurs when the key is initially turned to on, its also coming from near the AIR pump. I'm going to attach a video hopefully it will make these descriptions somewhat clearer.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QYJcr5VP-Vg

sweetbmxrider · 10-18-2010, 04:13 PM

that is baffling. i'd take a long screw driver and probe around on different objects while someone cycles the key.

also, make sure you aren't leaking oil or antifreeze and potentially contaminating your opti. check the opti harness too, the clip to the opti usually breaks and could cause an intermittent condition. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/95-96...item19beda4c45

vipergtx500 · 10-18-2010, 04:20 PM

I just recently replaced the Opti harness in June when I replaced the whole opti itself. I'll start probing around tomorrow and see if i can deduce anything.

vipergtx500 · 10-20-2010, 01:23 PM

forgot to mention that fuel pressure rose from 40-46 for a second every time this "cycle started over" going to check stuff out now

vipergtx500 · 10-20-2010, 02:48 PM

Nvm all that...As i was messing with the maf and unplugging it to see if it changed the way it ran, i was clearing the p0100 code and also saw a P1371 code, too few pulses low res aka optispark. If this is the case, which it most likely is, It only lasted about 5 months. I think something must be leaking on it which I really need to figure out.

This will be my replacement opti. because I just don't care anymore.

sweetbmxrider · 10-20-2010, 04:08 PM

that doesn't contain the electrical portion which is what you need. definitely look around for a leak. could be the waterpump weep hole or possibly the timing cover seal. definitely play detective.

vipergtx500 · 10-20-2010, 04:52 PM

In my frustration I didn't realize it was just the cap and rotor, This is better. I had noticed a slight amount of oil last time I replaced it but couldn't figure out where it was coming from so Ill make sure to locate and fix that before putting the new one on.
Thanks again everyone for your help. Looks like I should've followed my own logic in my sig.