Leasing a car

[BigAls87Z28]

Originally Posted by qwikz28

If you spec out a CTS to the Luxury package, its only about $2000 less than a CT6. The pricing doesn't really make sense.

I'm assuming that you meant the above.
First up: Lawd Jesus, the Cadillac website has to be the ugliest website of not only luxury cars, but of other GM brands.

Second, a loaded CTS VSport is still 14k less than a CT6 Platinum. Now, there is no Platinum trim CTS (there is no V and Plat trim available for a Cadillac, because reasons.) so it's not exactly an apples-to-apples comparison, but let's take a look at cars you want: CTS 2.0T RWD vs CT6 2.0T RWD

CT6 Luxury 2.0T RWD: $61,910.
CTS Luxury 2.0T RWD: $53,375

Almost a nine grand difference between the two trims. Only an absolute idiot would think that a nine grand gap is insignificant. CT6 does come with a lot more things standard, obviously, but it's more than the 2k you were talking about. Yeah, you can get a well equipped CTS for about the price of a base CT6, but you don't get cooled seats in that CT6. And trust me, your ass is gunna love you for getting the cooled seats.

[qwikz28]

Originally Posted by BigAls87Z28

I'm assuming that you meant the above.
First up: Lawd Jesus, the Cadillac website has to be the ugliest website of not only luxury cars, but of other GM brands.

Second, a loaded CTS VSport is still 14k less than a CT6 Platinum. Now, there is no Platinum trim CTS (there is no V and Plat trim available for a Cadillac, because reasons.) so it's not exactly an apples-to-apples comparison, but let's take a look at cars you want: CTS 2.0T RWD vs CT6 2.0T RWD

CT6 Luxury 2.0T RWD: $61,910.
CTS Luxury 2.0T RWD: $53,375

Almost a nine grand difference between the two trims. Only an absolute idiot would think that a nine grand gap is insignificant. CT6 does come with a lot more things standard, obviously, but it's more than the 2k you were talking about. Yeah, you can get a well equipped CTS for about the price of a base CT6, but you don't get cooled seats in that CT6. And trust me, your ass is gunna love you for getting the cooled seats.

Well, wait a minute. The Luxury package on the CTS doesn't give you the same features that the Luxury package on the CT6 does. If you look deeper, the fair comparison is the base model CT6 to the CTS Luxury. That gives you the most similar spec of features (except some techy gizmos that would be included in a $2500 option package on the CT6, but would then also add some features to the CT6 that makes it way better equipped than a CTS).

That said, the $9000 is inaccurate. It's somewhere between $2000-$4500. Trust me, I studied it this past weekend while the woman was napping and the pricing is nonsensical.

[BigAls87Z28]

Jake, the 9k gap was a joke and was not aimed at you. It was aimed at someone else in another thread where we talked about new GM cars.

Yeah, you could get a base model CT6 vs a well equipped CTS. CT6 has a lot of things going for it thanks to all the tech and engineering went into making the car.
A base CT6 vs CTS is a tough match. 2k price difference means about an additional $50 a month on a lease, but at that point what's $50.

That's quite the quandary. I think I still go well equipped CTS with cooled seats. Can't beat cooled seats.

[qwikz28]

Originally Posted by BigAls87Z28

Jake, the 9k gap was a joke and was not aimed at you. It was aimed at someone else in another thread where we talked about new GM cars.

Yeah, you could get a base model CT6 vs a well equipped CTS. CT6 has a lot of things going for it thanks to all the tech and engineering went into making the car.
A base CT6 vs CTS is a tough match. 2k price difference means about an additional $50 a month on a lease, but at that point what's $50.

That's quite the quandary. I think I still go well equipped CTS with cooled seats. Can't beat cooled seats.

Ah, and I see your point. I'll restate mine, though. Regarding the features that I want: you need the CTS Luxury to get them, but they are standard in the CT6 base. Looking further into it, the CTS Luxury is better equipped than a base CT6. It becomes a personal decision at that point.

I really can't stand the way carmakers do things in packages now. It's incredibly difficult to option a car how you want it without the price skyrocketing. I see why they do it, but as a consumer, it sucks.

By the way, my experience with cooled seats were really just puny computer fans blowing through perforated leather. My wife had them in her old Lexus. Never really cared for them.

[BigAls87Z28]

The fan on the last gen CTS-V's Recaros made up 70% of the weight and where probably taken from a large air hockey table.
GM makes cars for Americans, and they do not underestimate the size of Americans. They build the cooling system accordingly.

With that said, I personally love the look of the CTS over the CT6, but the whole upper tier luxury aspect of the CT6. I'd also say that it's going to be hard to find a RWD model on lots, which means 3.6 is the min. Look at the S class, A8, and 7 series; they are all are AWD. Now, those cars are also LWB models and start in the six figure range.

And that's the rub with the CT6. It's not a proper flagship, but it's too big to be a proper midsizer. It's not as stylish as a A7 or CLS, which is where it should be. it should have been a crazy take on the A&S design, bringing in something that really stands out as a "Cadillac". Instead, we get a straight up three box sedan with some fancy LED headlight accents and chrome accents around the tails.
The CT6 is designed for China, and it shows.

[qwikz28]

Originally Posted by BigAls87Z28

The fan on the last gen CTS-V's Recaros made up 70% of the weight and where probably taken from a large air hockey table.
GM makes cars for Americans, and they do not underestimate the size of Americans. They build the cooling system accordingly.

With that said, I personally love the look of the CTS over the CT6, but the whole upper tier luxury aspect of the CT6. I'd also say that it's going to be hard to find a RWD model on lots, which means 3.6 is the min. Look at the S class, A8, and 7 series; they are all are AWD. Now, those cars are also LWB models and start in the six figure range.

And that's the rub with the CT6. It's not a proper flagship, but it's too big to be a proper midsizer. It's not as stylish as a A7 or CLS, which is where it should be. it should have been a crazy take on the A&S design, bringing in something that really stands out as a "Cadillac". Instead, we get a straight up three box sedan with some fancy LED headlight accents and chrome accents around the tails.
The CT6 is designed for China, and it shows.

Are you still reporting for GM Inside News?

[BigAls87Z28]

Originally Posted by qwikz28

Are you still reporting for GM Inside News?

Nah, had to give it up with the last two promotions at my real job.

[qwikz28]

Here she is, 2016 CTS Base with a 2.0T and AWD:



Al was right on the money with two things: 1. The CT6 is way bigger and way more expensive, and 2. The air conditioned seats are fantastic. The car is super fun to drive, got a great deal on a 36 month lease for a dealer demo, and the rest is history. However, it's an interesting story so I'll share it.

My Saab was giving me a hard time on random cold starts, and although it has never left me stranded, gave me trouble one day in Jersey City where a tow truck would never be able to get to. Instead of waiting to find out if the car has a serious issue or if its just being temperamental, I decided to accelerate the process.

I went first to, let's call it Dealer 1, to look at a 2015 CTS with 5k miles. Cadillac is doing a low interest rate finance deal for certified used cars so that was my number one choice. The car ended up not having a sunroof which I figure will kill any resale value so I decided against that car.

They also had a "program car" which is essentially a demo car that has less than 6500 miles but will still be titled as new and can be leased. Seems like a great way to save a few bucks so I looked into it.

I received a quote from dealer 1 and then went to a different dealer (dealer 2) on program cars that differ only in interior color and mileage. Both for leases over 39 months with $2000 down and 12,000 miles per year.

Dealer 1: $647/month for a car with 6200 miles and black interior.
Dealer 2: $469/month for a car with 2300 miles and grey interior.

Not really sure why there is a nearly 30% discrepancy between the monthlies, but it seems like Dealer 1 was trying to take me for a ride. Dealer 2, however, was also way too low and didn't really add up. So I went to Dealer 3.

Dealer 3 was up front with me and told me that Dealer 2 gave me the same price they would offer, but they knew which dealer I had went to because the price failed to include taxes, which Dealer 2 is known for doing. I was put in a car to test drive, offered no pressure, and was talked through the numbers. I ended up bargaining minimally and shook hands on a black on black dealer demo.

Thanks for all your help. Tomorrow I'm returning the Saab to stock and running it through Adessa in a few weeks.

-Jake

[Blackbirdws6]

Congrats on the new ride. Take some more pictures and be sure to post impressions after some ownership time has passed. Cooled seats are an interesting experience the first time you use them. No one turns them off though lol.

[sweetbmxrider]

Niceeeeeee!!!!

[maroman88]

awesome! my aunt has purchased 2 used cadi's from mahwah.

[V]

Congrats! Nice car.

My mom bought her new '14 ats from mahwah. 15k under msrp. We had checked out a few dealers and didn't like how we were treated. Mahwah was very easy to work with. I'll be stopping by there in the winter seeing if they can locate a used car for me that matches what I'm looking for.

[qwikz28]

I'm quite happy with the guys at Mahwah. The car is damn great too. I've driven a contemporary 5 series and the CTS is much better to drive. Still struggling with Cue, though.

[BigAls87Z28]

Someone at Mahwah has ties with corporate. They always get visitors.

Photobucket shut down you picture, but congrats bro

[qwikz28]

Picture is back up, for now at least. What do you mean about Mahwah getting visitors?

[BigAls87Z28]

The last few Cadillac events I've been on, we go there and hang out with everyone.

[qwikz28]

I don't do much driving these days since my commute is about 5 miles and we take my wife's Jeep most of the time, but after almost two months I have put almost 1500 miles on the car and wanted to give my input. Cliff notes: Pics at the bottom, car is comfy, fun to drive, but the transmission blows.

First, the car is very smooth and easy to drive. My father has a 2010 CTS and right away, he got in and felt more comfortable driving it than his own. He, a man that admits to not being able to tell the difference between any new car, was blown away at the improvement from his car. Acceleration from the 2.0T is shocking, but not as surprising as the handling. My Saab was lowered on Koni shocks and Vogtland springs and the larger CTS would easily hang with it in the corners given the same tires. But where the Saab bounced around and crashed on bumps, the CTS is properly comfortable and easy on your piles.

I've driven a modern Audi A6 and BMW 535i, and my good friend has a 2013 MB E350 that I'm in quite often. They all have nicer interiors but the seats in the Cadillac are still the most comfortable. The BMW was my least favorite of the bunch, but the chassis in the CTS is bar-none in terms of handling and ride quality.

I do have a few gripes about the car, and the main one is the new 8 speed transmission. My goodness, it is terrible. Downshifts are slow to the point where you sometimes have to lift after trying to merge because you waited seconds for it to downshift, only to realize it is no longer safe to merge. And if you are patient enough, it downshifts 3 or 4 gears and the car jolts forward. It's tough to modulate. Even when you're cruising, the car can get confused and slam into another gear. It's strange and unsettling. I'm sure a software update could fix it, but right now, I almost wish I purchased the used 2015 model. I will say, though, upshifts are snappy and the tall highway gear is nice with the car's highest average over a 50 mile span being 32.5mpg.

My other gripes include a sometimes finnicky CUE system which is no where near as bad as reviewers make it out to be, some cheap looking GM parts bin interior items, ugly gauges in the base model, cheap GM carpeting (the Germans get deep pile) and some questionable stitching on the steering wheel. Also, the dealer network is not comparable to the BMW and Audi dealers I've interacted with and have had to discuss the service teams' incompetence with my salesperson after leaving my car for a day and then being told they were unsure what they were supposed to do.

Nonetheless, I love the car and don't miss my Saab as much as I thought I would. Looking forward to replacing it with that beautiful CT6.

[elle]

Get it tuned by Blackbear. All of our new vehicles 2011 and newer I get done right away because the trans shifts drive me nuts!! $299 the last time I got it done. He comes to Jersey a few times a year. Last time I met him at a hotel in Somerset and it took about 30-40 mins.

[qwikz28]

Time for the almost year review (10.5 months I believe). A few months ago, this happened:



My dad liked mine so much he ended up buying one himself (his has the 3.6 and luxury package, but otherwise same color combo and everything). Anyway, I have put a touch over 8000 miles on my car since I got it, and a few more comments if anyone is wondering:

1. The seatbelt quality is so poor that there is metal frayed ends sticking out that ruined a few of my nice shirts. I'll have to wrap it in cloth come summer when I'm not wearing a jacket to work everyday.
2. The backseat is very small for a car this size. I read that has to do with it being based on the ATS platform.
3. The transmission has learned my driving style better and doesn't suck as much as I thought it did when I bought it. I also learned this is par for the course with modern turbo motors and autos with way too many gears.
4. Despite being AWD, the car is RWD biased and likes to oversteer in the slippery stuff.
5. The runflats this car came with are awful. Worse than awful actually. I tried to convince my wife to let me take them off and save them for the end of the lease and just throw some better tires on there for now, but she laughed at me.

Other than that, the car has been great. It's very comfortable, surprisingly quick and shockingly good in the turns. The car really does have a split personality. Only one unscheduled trip to the dealer for a CEL light that ended up being a service bulletin for a battery sensor, but I had to drive to South Jersey the next day, so it was nice to put those miles on a loaner anyway

tl;dr - love the car one year later, dad bought the same one, only one issue since getting it

[maroman88]

dealer wont replace seatbelt??
i drove an ats 2.0t rwd, smoked the tires much to my surprise

[qwikz28]

Originally Posted by maroman88

dealer wont replace seatbelt??
i drove an ats 2.0t rwd, smoked the tires much to my surprise

I haven't asked to be honest. I assumed it was a quality issue, rather than a manufacturing issue. I really didn't think to ask the dealership or even compare it to my dad's car.

I'm going to report back later today. Thanks!

[qwikz28]

I said goodbye to my Cadillac today. In early summer of 2017, I signed on a client that has taken me throughout NJ and NY and I found myself driving about 1500-1800 miles per month. To keep the miles down, I would take my mother's car on days I knew I was driving a lot. Still, I knew the lease end was going to be costly if I didn't make a move soon. Long story short, I decided to check local dealerships for sales and the discounts on leftover Regals were almost unbelievable. I checked out two cars and realized that what I wanted was a car with no options. My local dealership had exactly four in stock. In the end, I walked away with a Regal that stickers for over $29k, for $21,800 and the dealership ate the remaining $1500 in lease payments on my Cadillac. I actually walked away from that deal at first because the dealership wouldn't agree to cover the cost of additional wear and tear on my Cadillac (which isn't customary, but was my main requirement) but after I ran into the dealership's owner at the Cadillac dealership across the highway, he offered to personally cover the cost if I went back and made the deal that night. So I did. I took a quick cell phone picture before it got too dark.

I'll miss the Cadillac though. That car was the perfect blend of comfort and sport. It did everything so well and with ease. Leasing turned out to be a mistake for me, but I'm glad I learned that now. I thought about buying the car outright, and probably would have if I didn't make this deal, but basically $20k for a brand new Regal was too good to pass up. I'll probably put some Cascada wheels and summer tires on it to freshen the car a little bit, but overall, I'm very happy with my purchase and happy to be in a car that I don't have to worry about mileage again. If anyone is looking for a new car right now, get a Regal before New Years because the discounts on them are outstanding.

[Blackbirdws6]

I approve of this top notch negotiation. That's a lot of car for $20k. Good luck with it.

[Jersey Mike]

That's ridiculous. IANAL but I think you just committed a crime against that dealership

[qwikz28]

Haven't been on the forums in a while. Work and life has been a bit crazy. In addition to my law office, I opened a title insurance company a little over a year ago. Covid has actually caused my work to become busier for which I am grateful, but haven't had much time for anything these days between both companies increasing in volume. But figured I'd check in with at least one of my car happenings.

First thing's first, I bought my first non-GM car or myself (my wife has a Jeep, and I did own a Saab which was after the GM sale but definitely developed under GM). It's a CPO 2019 Volvo S60 T6. It has the R design package, the advanced package with the self driving, and the Polestar tune. It had 12k miles but Volvo offers unlimited mileage warranties for their CPO cars up to 5 years from original delivery date which is why I chose to go with Volvo. The car drives great and I'm definitely happy with it. I've had it for two months now and it's still a blast to drive. Much more sport biased than I expected.


The reason for the new car is below. The Buick has an issue that no one can seem to trace. I hired a lemon law attorney to negotiate a buyback from GM. Here's how it went down:

The first time the car went wrong, I was driving along uphill going about 30-40mph and the car downshifted on its own into first gear out of nowhere. The dash lit up and the car slowed to 10mph or so. I tried upshifting in manual mode, nothing. I coasted into a parking lot, called roadside and they took the car to Mahwah Buick. Car insisted I wasn't in park and wouldn't turn the ignition off (although the engine stopped). Dealership replaced the battery, said the transmission control module was failing but they ordered a new one and would replace it when it comes in, but to take it because it was working. Here's a video of the first incident: https://youtu.be/g3URm9YI1p8

That same day I picked it up, took it to work, when I went to go home, same lights on the dash. This time, I turned it off and on but it wouldn't restart. Called roadside and they took the car to Mahwah Buick. Dealership indicated this time it was going to be in for a long time while they wait for the master mechanic to put eyes on it. After a week, they had replaced a transmission valve body and reflashed the transmission control module (not replaced it, part still wasn't in) but said this was definitely it and they were certain of it. Here's another video: https://youtu.be/93JABLdRe9k

Car seemed to be working fine and drove the car for another two weeks or so thereafter. But then, it happened again but this time while I was on the New Jersey turnpike. I was lucky because you can see in this clip, it turned back on while I was driving and I was able to steer and maneuver for a few seconds into the shoulder and then coast the car into a rest area. Mind you, this with no engine and no power brakes. I was very fortunate it happened exactly where it did. I called roadside again. They took the car to Bellavia Chevrolet. This dealership was leaps and bounds better and the service manager there really took this on his shoulders to get the car right. He seemed confident at first but once he came up short, he contacted GM corporate who also tried to diagnose the car. Like the other incidents, disconnecting the battery for a long period of time got the issue to resolve itself, but then they couldn't diagnose it from there. The service manager gave up and told me to come get it. He was apologetic and told me he even drove the car himself for a week or so to try an replicate the issue. A video of the issue happening in process is here: https://youtu.be/8SM8_hRxrbg

Loaners are hard to come by at these dealers so I was using my cousin's Mazda during the time but eventually he needed it back so I bought the Volvo. My job has me driving a lot so I needed a car. The Buick is sitting for now until the car can be bought back. We're outside lemon law because of the mileage but the attorney has had success in similar circumstances. We'll see.