Please no Spectator Voting!! I beg you!

[90FormulaWS6]

Originally Posted by HardcoreZ28

Ummm....Like me

LOL hows PT?

[HardcoreZ28]

Originally Posted by 90FormulaWS6

LOL hows PT?

Leaving thursday morning so I can't tell you yet. But if it's anything like I'm imagining then I might just not come back hahaha. I've been reading the Power Tour message boards and talking to a few locals who have gone in the past and it sounds like it will be a blast. I'll be sure to give everyone a synopsis as well as post pics when I get back.

[JL8Jeff]

The problem with having actual judges is that you need well defined rules for each category. Even then, it still comes down to the judges personal preference to what they like. Fan judging works well for this kind of a show.

[HardcoreZ28]

Originally Posted by JL8Jeff

The problem with having actual judges is that you need well defined rules for each category. Even then, it still comes down to the judges personal preference to what they like. Fan judging works well for this kind of a show.

I still disagree. I say get a group of 3-4 judges. Maybe get someone who's familiar with each generation to judge the whole class. I'd be willing to judge if you guys want. Just have someone else judge my class...I'll do any others. Maybe Justin, Tim, PamperedZ, and I can make up the judging team?

[Pampered-Z]

Well this year I will be on the track kicking butt ( NJSlowPoke - you READING THIS???)

But if I was in the show I like the idea of all the people being able to vote for what they like. The problem with one set judge is that they will need to be given an established criteria. Even with that it is easy to define Stock/Restored cars, but anything custom is simply a matter of the owner's style, and how someone else reacts to it.

I know the one guy from DE looked at my car ( which I bought used in 1994 ) and looked at me and said " Do you realize your build date is so low this might be one of the first M6 cars ever built and be real collectable?" So maybe in his mine I killed a great car with all my mods. Other people commented on the nice work I did. Same car, very different reaction!

If you want set judges, here is a suggestion: We did this with the CJCFO in past shows and I think it is a valid thing to discuss:

The winners of the previous year became the judges. One year Injuneer and I won, so we became the judges for the following year. This way we had set judges as well as no repeat winners every year, now we can set this so the person could win another class and Best Of Show could still be awarded to the person? Maybe last years judges could be called upon to vote for the best of what they won, and leave best of show/best of Gen to the spectators.

My point of view,,,John B.

[The BIG Show]

You can please some of the people all of the time, and all of the people some of the time, but you can't please all of the people all of the time.

C'mon guys. It's not that big of a deal. No one ever made a career out of winning two-dolla trophies. It's all about egos. A crowd favorite is the best way to go. It makes the most mathematical sense. The percentages are the most fair. If you're looking for professional judges, go to professional shows, not car club shows. But if not, I would be the best judge. I've done it before, my car is 3500 miles away, I have nothing to gain or prove, and I just don't care who wins, loses, lives or dies. Ask the NJCFO guys that go to C&R on a yearly basis. Cars just get you from one place to another. I drive a p.o.s that my neighbor gave me for free. It has four wheels, gets me where I need to go, has tunes, good a/c, it's comfortable, and no one looks at it twice...perfect. Just how I like it.

The bottom line is that if you don't like how it's run, don't go.

[Fozzi58]

Originally Posted by HardcoreZ28

there are those of us who are very serious about the appearance of our cars and expect our part of the competition to be treated just as seriously.

Originally Posted by 90FormulaWS6

PSHHHH LIKE WHO?

Originally Posted by HardcoreZ28

Ummm....Like me

Like me.

I respect the racers and their seriousness to the competition. However, I'm not a racer - I'm a show guy. But like the racers, I expect the same type of seriousness to the show judging as racers expect to track conditions, etc.

I'm somewhat indifferent on the judged/people's choice thing. I've been to enough shows to know that most "judged" shows are biased against new or modern cars. If its open class judging, its almost always "nastalgia" that wins. And its not about $2 trophies, its about pride in your ride. When you're told 100s of times at a show, "Nice ride", and you leave empty handed, it makes you wonder what the judges were thinking. I, as many of us, put a lot of thought, time, work, and last but not least, money into our cars. A measly plastic trophy or plaque makes the effort all worth while.

I was fortunate enough to pick up 3rd place 4th gen last year and that at least lets me know someone besides the crew I was there with voted for my car (I hope).

[HardcoreZ28]

I'm in total agreement with Fozzi.....still torn between spectator vs judged voting but he's dead on about the seriousness. I think the problem with spectator voting at a show like ours is the number of people in attendance. Like mentioned earlier if you have a large group of friends with you then you're at an advantage. At a larger show such as E-Town or something similar then the friend factor is diluted a bit more.

Either way you know I'll be there showing because when it all comes down to it it's about the cars and the comroderie....oh and the advertising

[Fozzi58]

Originally Posted by HardcoreZ28

oh and the advertising

LOL

[zoomin iroc]

I'm all for spectator voting, It gives people in attendance a reason to feel involved. It also causes people to pay closer attention to your car, ask questions and enjoy the hobby without the expense of actually buying and building a car. It may spark a person's interest enough to get them to join in the hobby.

On the other hand, The idea of a panel of judges made up from past winners is interesting. Why not have both? The judges would not judge every class, Just a few special ones. -Call it "Gold Seal Award" or "Judges choice" or perhaps the "I'm better than you as judged buy people that actually matter award" Anyway, the trophies are only a few bucks each so why not? I for one would be very proud to receive a "Judges think I rock trophy"

Plus it shows respect or "Gives props" (If you watch too much MTV) to those who have won before. Past winners more than anyone know what goes into creating a car worthy of a "Best Whatever Trophy" It is right to honor those individuals who haved walked the walk. It's kinda like a gift that keeps on giving. Sorta like the clap except that it doesn't burn like Hell-fire when you piss. Just my thoughts.....

[NJSPEEDER]

a panel of past winners leads back to the "that guy is friends with....." or claims of people just picking their own cars again.

[zoomin iroc]

"Picking their own cars" really? You can't be serious.

[NJSPEEDER]

it is just one of the many great stories i have heard used to place the blame on judges for the way a show turned out.

[zoomin iroc]

Un freakin' believable !!! Isn't Corvettes at Carlisle the same weekend?

[97transam]

Originally Posted by NJSPEEDER

...the best engine award went to pamperedz.

NO WAY!!!! That's it, this is war!!!

Originally Posted by Pampered-Z

Well this year I will be on the track kicking butt

You better. ..and you owe me a rematch. I'll have a few "secrets" under the hood making me quicker so you won't fall asleep and roll the car into a red light while you were waiting 3.7 minutes for your green light.


My take on the judging / people's vote: if there's a judge I might have a slim chance, but if it's people's choice... I'm on the track. I come to the realization a long time ago that the 97 TA is nothing "special" to people at a standing car show. It has won a few car show trophies and a couple of plaques, but I haven't spent that kind of money and time to make it outstanding amongst a dozen of it's bretheren. Plus it was frustrating and tiring to compete with a daily ride with well over 50K miles against trailer queens. So I personally found myself going the dark way of spending money to make the car more fun for 13 seconds. (Tim warned me about this at Atco).

Com'on people, watch biker build off or like shows, these guys bring dream machines to an event and the people choose the winner. No judges. Some people like bling bling, some like the classic lines. Oh well and good luck.

Btw, I'll vote for you if it's black and clean... I don't do bright colors or bling