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03-14-2013, 11:28 AM
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#1
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: Jim Thorpe PA
Posts: 2,133
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Rear rebuilt whines just as loud as before.
Just had my 12bolt rebuilt. New Motive 4:11's all new bearings, and a lightly used posi I purchased off of Deadtrend. Its still as loud as it was before they set it up ear piercing when cruising at 50. Gear issue or installer?
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01 SS 383 stroker, Magnum F, 9in.
86 Trans-Am 355 t56
Last edited by B4C; 03-14-2013 at 01:55 PM.
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03-14-2013, 12:31 PM
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#2
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Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Harrison NJ
Posts: 880
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Quote:
Originally Posted by B4C
Just had my 12bolt rebuilt. New Motive 4:11's all new bearings, and a lightly used posi I purchased off of Deadtrend. Its still as loud as it was before they set it up ear piercing when cruising at 50. Gear issue or installer?
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installer
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03-14-2013, 12:56 PM
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#3
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Ayatollah of Rock N Rolla / Admin
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Parts Unknown
Posts: 12,573
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WSex
installer
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Yup.
On accel? Decel? Cruising? All the time?
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03-14-2013, 01:13 PM
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#4
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: Jim Thorpe PA
Posts: 2,133
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WildBillyT
Yup.
On accel? Decel? Cruising? All the time?
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Crusing and decel.
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01 SS 383 stroker, Magnum F, 9in.
86 Trans-Am 355 t56
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03-14-2013, 01:17 PM
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#5
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Ayatollah of Rock N Rolla / Admin
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Parts Unknown
Posts: 12,573
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Did you call the place that did it? Sounds like maybe a pinion bearing preload or backlash issue.
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03-14-2013, 01:23 PM
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#6
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: Jim Thorpe PA
Posts: 2,133
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WildBillyT
Did you call the place that did it? Sounds like maybe a pinion bearing preload or backlash issue.
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Yes they said they set the backlash alittle loose at .010, motive recommends .007-.009. Didnt ask about the bearing pre-load, although they did replace them. Its ear piercing at 50mph cruise.
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01 SS 383 stroker, Magnum F, 9in.
86 Trans-Am 355 t56
Last edited by B4C; 03-14-2013 at 01:23 PM.
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03-14-2013, 02:27 PM
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#7
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Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Blackwood, NJ
Posts: 2,295
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So they set the backlash out of spec of what the manufacture says? What about a Drive shaft causing the whine? Were the bearings on the carrier replaced as well as the bearings at the end of the Axle tubes?
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Jeff
2002 WS6 T/A.. M6..Built 383 TMR tune..461rwhp,458rwtq
2009 G8 GT. Bone stock 13.6@103.. Vararam Intake, GXP Axlebacks, LS2 FRC's
1998 Corvette Convertible, Vararam Intake+Power Duct, Fast 90/90, Ti Axleback..12.8@110
2003 Cobra Convertible 10th Anniversary
http://www.fquick.com/slow-v6
Local car cruise schedule..
http://www.cliffscalendar.com/
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03-14-2013, 02:34 PM
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#8
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Ayatollah of Rock N Rolla / Admin
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Parts Unknown
Posts: 12,573
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Quote:
Originally Posted by B4C
Yes they said they set the backlash alittle loose at .010, motive recommends .007-.009. Didnt ask about the bearing pre-load, although they did replace them. Its ear piercing at 50mph cruise.
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Did they use a new crush sleeve, pinion nut, etc?
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03-14-2013, 02:40 PM
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#9
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Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Blackwood, NJ
Posts: 2,295
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I also heard if you dont locktite the Pinion nut they can back out as well.
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Jeff
2002 WS6 T/A.. M6..Built 383 TMR tune..461rwhp,458rwtq
2009 G8 GT. Bone stock 13.6@103.. Vararam Intake, GXP Axlebacks, LS2 FRC's
1998 Corvette Convertible, Vararam Intake+Power Duct, Fast 90/90, Ti Axleback..12.8@110
2003 Cobra Convertible 10th Anniversary
http://www.fquick.com/slow-v6
Local car cruise schedule..
http://www.cliffscalendar.com/
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03-14-2013, 02:44 PM
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#10
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: Jim Thorpe PA
Posts: 2,133
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WildBillyT
Did they use a new crush sleeve, pinion nut, etc?
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All new except the pinion nut.
__________________
01 SS 383 stroker, Magnum F, 9in.
86 Trans-Am 355 t56
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03-14-2013, 03:26 PM
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#11
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: Jim Thorpe PA
Posts: 2,133
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Screw it Im ordering a 9in housing tomorrow Im sick of 12 bolts, Ill get the housing and then the center once I sell this 12 bolt.
__________________
01 SS 383 stroker, Magnum F, 9in.
86 Trans-Am 355 t56
Last edited by B4C; 03-14-2013 at 03:26 PM.
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03-14-2013, 03:29 PM
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#12
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Ayatollah of Rock N Rolla / Admin
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Parts Unknown
Posts: 12,573
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What? Why not go back to the guy who did it and have him fix it?
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03-14-2013, 03:33 PM
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#13
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: Jim Thorpe PA
Posts: 2,133
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WildBillyT
What? Why not go back to the guy who did it and have him fix it?
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He said its the way the gears are cut since I got motive performance gears, even tho I swear I bought street gears. Reading into it it seems Motive has gone to crap in the past 3 years since moving production from US to China.
I also supplied all the parts too so they cant warranty them.
__________________
01 SS 383 stroker, Magnum F, 9in.
86 Trans-Am 355 t56
Last edited by B4C; 03-14-2013 at 03:35 PM.
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03-14-2013, 03:34 PM
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#14
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Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: North Jersey
Posts: 464
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what Bill said !!!!!! ASAP
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03-14-2013, 03:41 PM
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#15
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Ayatollah of Rock N Rolla / Admin
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Parts Unknown
Posts: 12,573
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Quote:
Originally Posted by B4C
He said its the way the gears are cut since I got motive performance gears, even tho I swear I bought street gears. Reading into it it seems Motive has gone to crap in the past 3 years since moving production from US to China.
I also supplied all the parts too so they cant warranty them.
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That's ********. He can't warranty the parts, fine, but this is a labor issue. Gears should not "howl" very loudly at 50mph.
Did he mention a break-in period for the gears? I'm guessing no.
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03-14-2013, 03:41 PM
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#16
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: Jim Thorpe PA
Posts: 2,133
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No he did not. Im gonna call again tomorrow. I went to Kaspers Korner in Clementon.
__________________
01 SS 383 stroker, Magnum F, 9in.
86 Trans-Am 355 t56
Last edited by B4C; 03-14-2013 at 03:42 PM.
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03-14-2013, 03:44 PM
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#17
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Ayatollah of Rock N Rolla / Admin
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Parts Unknown
Posts: 12,573
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Quote:
Originally Posted by B4C
No he did not. Im gonna call again tomorrow.
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Before you throw it in a river with cinder blocks tied to the axle shafts, do that and see what he says.
The no-break in thing should always be a huge red flag (unless it's a drag or circle track setup).
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03-14-2013, 03:48 PM
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#18
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: Jim Thorpe PA
Posts: 2,133
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WildBillyT
Before you throw it in a river with cinder blocks tied to the axle shafts, do that and see what he says.
The no-break in thing should always be a huge red flag (unless it's a drag or circle track setup).
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How do you even break it in. I called once already because the kids at the desk just handed me the paper work took my money and said nothing. The guy on the phone seemed pretty cool but seemed more interested in doing unrelated work to my car. I just drove it in traffic for about 10 mins then let it sit then drove for another 10 min and havnt driven it since.
__________________
01 SS 383 stroker, Magnum F, 9in.
86 Trans-Am 355 t56
Last edited by B4C; 03-14-2013 at 03:50 PM.
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03-14-2013, 03:49 PM
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#19
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Ayatollah of Rock N Rolla / Admin
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Parts Unknown
Posts: 12,573
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Better than I can write:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Randy Lyman
Do we really need to break in a new gear set? I have heard many people say "When I bought my new truck, no one ever told me to break in the ring & pinion." Whenever we are blessed enough to afford a new vehicle, we take it easy on the engine for the first few hundred miles. While we are pampering the engine (probably for the last time ever), the ring & pinion set goes along for the ride and gets a chance to break in before we hammer the throttle.
In most stock vehicles with stock tires there is seldom a risk of a burned gear set. For those of us who modify and use our trucks, there many situations that can contribute to burned gear syndrome. Motorhomes, towing, tall tires, and high numeric gear ratios (4.56 & up) can all generate a lot of heat and cause the gear oil to break down. The greatest damage to a new gear set results from running for ten minutes or more during the first 500 miles when the oil is very hot. Any heavy use or overloading while the oil is extremely hot will cause it to break down and allow irreversible damage to the ring & pinion.
In order to make them run cooler and quieter, new gears are lapped at the factory. However, they are not lapped under the same pressures that driving creates. The loads generated while driving force any microscopic high spots on the gear teeth back into the surface of the metal. This is called "work hardening". Work hardening is similar to forging in the way that it compresses the metal molecules into a very compact and hard formation. This can only be accomplished if the metal surfaces are lubricated and the gear temperature stays cool enough that the molecular structure does not change. If the temperature of the metal gets hot enough to change the molecular structure, it will soften the surface instead of hardening it. This may seen like a balancing act, but it all happens easily and passively as long as the oil keeps the gear cool while it is breaking in. Some of the synthetic oils on the market today can help a gear set live longer. I've had great success with Red Line ®, Torco ®, and Richmond Gear ® synthetic gear oils. These oils will continue to lubricate at temperatures where many crude oils break down.
Even with synthetic oils, I still recommend the following procedure for breaking in a new gear set: After driving the first 15 to 20 miles, stop and let the differential cool before proceeding. Keep the vehicle at speeds below 60 mph for the first 100 miles. I also recommend putting at least 500 miles on the new gear set before heavy use or towing. During the first 45 miles of towing, it helps to go about 15 miles at a time before stopping to let the differential cool for 15 minutes before continuing. This is necessary because not all of the gear tooth is making contact until it is heavily loaded. When towing, the teeth flex to contact completely, and cause the previously unloaded portion of the teeth to touch and work harden. It is very easy to damage the ring & pinion by overloading before the teeth are broken-in. If you take it easy on a new ring & pinion and keep it full of high quality oil, it will last a lot longer.
With regards to limited slip additives, I have found that using too much additive can lead to premature gear wear. Use just enough to keep the limited slip from chattering but not more than 4 oz for every 2 qts of oil. It is a good idea to change the gear oil after the first 500 miles in order to remove any metal particles or phosphorus coating that has come from the new gear set. This is cheap insurance and a good time to discover any problems before they grow too big.
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03-14-2013, 03:59 PM
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#20
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: Jim Thorpe PA
Posts: 2,133
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Moser says to use non-synthetic fluid. Its also 85w-90 would a heavier fluid help.
__________________
01 SS 383 stroker, Magnum F, 9in.
86 Trans-Am 355 t56
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03-14-2013, 04:07 PM
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#21
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Ayatollah of Rock N Rolla / Admin
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Parts Unknown
Posts: 12,573
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I do not think so.
I run 75w90 in my 9".
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03-14-2013, 04:31 PM
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#22
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Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Millstone, NJ
Posts: 641
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Ur supposed to break in ur rear if u put all new bearing in such in. Im running 140w85 i believe in my 10 bolt. Yukon supposedly makes some good gears
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94 TA GT. Stock 350, cam, exhaust
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03-14-2013, 04:35 PM
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#23
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BadMod
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: hamilton, nj
Posts: 8,889
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dudbird113
Ur supposed to break in ur rear if u put all new bearing in such in. Im running 140w85 i believe in my 10 bolt. Yukon supposedly makes some good gears
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140w85?
__________________
So much stupid, so little time.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 79CamaroDiva
It started before I drove your car. I just have to look at it the wrong way and your car poops parts.
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Mercerville MotorSports, LLC
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03-14-2013, 05:08 PM
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#24
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Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Harrison NJ
Posts: 880
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dudbird113
Ur supposed to break in ur rear if u put all new bearing in such in. Im running 140w85 i believe in my 10 bolt. Yukon supposedly makes some good gears
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike
140w85?
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same thing as concrete..
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03-14-2013, 05:20 PM
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#25
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Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Millstone, NJ
Posts: 641
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140wsomething. Lucas makes it. Richmond recommended their heavy gear oil which was synthetic which my posi doesnt like
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94 TA GT. Stock 350, cam, exhaust
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