brakes and steering... kinda sketchy.

[V]

My GTA runs and drives, and that's kinda all I can really say about it right now, lol. The car previously sat 7-8 years. The handling and braking does not instill much confidence. So over the fall/winter I want to correct that.
**Only new parts installed so far are rear shocks(AC Delco) and front/rear sway bar end links(AC Delco).**

Upon initial heavy braking, the car seems to want to go left and right randomly. It doesn't always seem to pull in the same direction every time.
It'll seem to wander left and right and I'll have to correct with steering.
From what I could tell, no caliper is sticking. There is no excessive heat build up on any rotor/wheel while/after driving.
I plan on starting by just replacing all the rubber brakes lines. I had a pulling issue in my old 88 GTA and it was one line which would swell causing it to pull. After that, I'm thinking just installing new calipers. However, before I do calipers, I would want to make sure the issue isnt more steering related than brakes.

The steering is very vague. I have a lot of play while driving down the road. When going in a straight line, I can turn the steering wheel 45-60 degrees(like 5-6 inches) with no reaction from the car. Steering column/steering wheel itself is tight and seems not to be the issue. It would therefore lie between the rag joint, steering box, and linkage to wheels. Can the steering box loosen up that much? Or should I focus more on the tie rods and pivots for the steering linkage? I looked at all the ball joints and even though they weren't new, they weren't loose(by hand). Should I also consider the lower control arm bushings as a possible cause? I looked at them and they seemed intact. I really need a second person to help me diagnose the steering since I can't turn the wheel and be under the car at the same time so see what has slack in it. That's why I'm asking for help narrowing it down. Maybe I'll set up a camera or something next time I have a chance to look at the car.

[BonzoHansen]

You need to check the whole front end before you go off on any tangent. I would not be surprised if the idler and centerlink are wiped, very common.

[sweetbmxrider]

What Bonzo said are definitely common and check them but the play in the wheel is usually the rag joint on these cars and a steering box can definitely have that play as well. Start with those 4 and another set of hands/eyes to pinpoint it. I think the wandering while braking is more likely steering related. Check/replace the components causing the play issue and get the car aligned! Then evaluate your braking situation, in my opinion.

[maroman88]

my 88 camaro feels exactly the same after sitting for 6 years. ive pawned it off on next season already -___-

[IROCZman15]

Yea. Check the rag joint assembly. In fact as an upgrade get one of the Chevy Astro van shafts and bolt that up in place. It uses u-joints instead of the rag joint. I got mine for about $50 and it was welded up right and painted from Matt walker on thirdgen.org. But I saw him in person at Carlisle so I didn't have to pay shipping. You could also try to find one at a local u-pull it yard too though. As also mentioned above, the center link and idler Arm could be worn out. Also there has been some long long discussions about the steering boxes in these cars on the thirdgen .org forum. Some people mod them too or swap to a refurbished high-ratio one. I think that car being a GTA it should have the high ratio box but maybe it's worn inside. Or simply maybe just has an air bubble in the fluid system/lines/resivour


As for brake lines... skip rubber ones and get some stainless steel braided lines instead

[V]

Well, the brakes currently got almost 100% better than they were the first time I took the car out, so I do believe air could still be in the lines. Master was full though while the car sat all those years. I sucked out what I could and refilled with fresh fluid. I still have to do a full bleed to flush the rest of the system.

I thought about stainless steel lines and even ls1 brake upgrade, however I want the car to remain 100% stock, or as close to it that I can. So that means using as many oem or oem style parts that i can. I'm trying to stick to a/c delco parts when possible.

[eric-86sc]

Why not just replace the entire front suspension and be done? I always do that to every third gen I keep for myself since the parts are 25 years old or more. It's not that expensive either

[V]

I FINALLY got around to taking a look at the steering...

https://flic.kr/p/WmnLya

Also, all tie rods ends seemed loose and worn, plus the idler arm to idler arm bracket pivot was loose too. So, I just ordered new center link, new idler arm, new inner and outer tie rods and new tie rod adjusting sleeves. I also ordered new front brake lines.
The car still has a few other issues I need to investigate but with my limited free time at least it's roadworthy and after the steering fixes it'll be safer to drive.

[V]

Steering components are basically all off the car, only the column itself and the gear box remain. Getting the center link off from the pitman arm was a pain. Also ripped out the intermediate steering shaft since it had a torn boot and more play than I'd like. I just ordered a modified astro van shaft for it and all the other MOOG steering components will be here wed/thurs. That should all take care of the wandering steering.

Now for the brakes... They looked pretty decent in terms of rotor wear and brake pad life. My biggest complaint was that it would pull to the side at first upon braking. So I ordered new front rubber brake hoses. Swelling of the old hoses could be causing the uneven braking.

My secondary complaint was that it seemed like one, or both, front brakes were almost always dragging somewhat. With the car sitting for a while without brakes having been applied, the wheels turn fine but I can hear the pad dragging on the rotor more than I feel it should. I have not noticed any excessive heat build up though whenever I'd drive the car. After doing some more reading online, bad rubber lines could also be a cause of this and not allowing the caliper to open fast enough or fully. So after I put the new lines on this week, I'll have to address this issue again to see if it goes away. I also figure I'll pop the calipers off after I do the hoses and clean and re-grease the caliper guide pins to make sure thats not the reason.

[BonzoHansen]

Hoses, center link, idler arm...third gen 101 lol. Glad it was the easy stuff

Pickle fork ought to get the CL off the pitman quick.

[V]

Originally Posted by BonzoHansen

Pickle fork ought to get the CL off the pitman quick.

It broke the "fork" off my pickle... lol.
I ended up using a floor jack under the pitman arm to support it from moving and to hold it steady while I beat down on the threads from under the hood. A 30" long, 1" diameter solid steel bar works wonders when smashing it down vertically on the centerlink joint.

[sweetbmxrider]

I don't know the exact setup/room available but I usually get a puller/fork with decent pressure on it then smack the side of the component with a hammer till it pops off. Keep stepping up your hammer size till it works

[V]

Today I finished up the steering rebuild.
New center link, new idler arm w/mount, new inner and outer tierods. I also replaced the worn intermediate steering shaft. I bought a modded astrovan shaft from Walter Racecraft which eliminates the oem knuckle joint and rag joint with actual solid u joints.
It now drives like a completely different car. Steering is tight and responsive. I got it back together almost exactly the way the old setup was in terms of alignment. Once I get new tires, I'll take it for a real alignment.

I also changed the front brake hoses. The previous owner didn't have the passenger side hose securely properly in the brackets and was missing one of the hose retainer clips, not that it caused anything but now its all back together the way it should be with a replacement clip. After I swapped the hoses, I opened the bleeder on the drivers caliper but I could not managed to open the bleeder on the passenger caliper. After a while of trying with line wrenches, box end wrenches, and finally vise-grips, it was stripped and rounded smooth. I acknowledged defeat and went to advance auto and bought 2 brand new calipers and a set of pads. No point in doing just one side. The rotors were fine so they stayed. The old pads had a good amount of life left on them but they were just old so I wasn't going to reuse them.
Car stops pretty good now after the test drive. No more pulling to either side upon braking and I also don't hear the front brakes dragging as I did prior. So maybe that was a hose or a caliper issue, either way its fixed now.

Future repairs to the front end will be new struts, new strut mounts, and new control arm bushings. That will come during the winter maybe. Tires are the next priority then trans service(leaking gasket) and rear brake check/pad replacement. Oh and I need to fix the always-on 2nd cooling fan(ect sensor probably).

Now I at least feel better than I can drive the car further than a couple of miles from the garage.