GM to repay loans Weds

[SteveR]

Al, you know I love you. I'm not making fun or intentionally trying to stir up crap. It's just insulting when GM goes on tv and says they paid all the money back then it comes out that they are lying. It's also curious to me why a company like GM that has had unarguably the WORST marketing department in the history of marketing where they can't even market their own products, suddenly spends all this money for the production of and air time for this commercial. To me, and a lot of people I've talked to, it just looks like GM is trying to polish up its image before asking for more money from somewhere.

[BigAls87Z28]

GM is trying to get itself out of the limelight of the right. No one there wants to talk about BK, and they dont ever want to go back.
GM is full of some bright people, but I cant imagine that they thought they could pull the wool over our eyes. I cant imagine that the current administration would make a mistake like that after being attacked from day one!
Maybe Im just more optimisitic then some.
All of GM's new cars are selling well, and at high transaction prices and with no rebates.
GM is still spending money because they must get new and better product out faster then everyone else.
GM wants to clean up thier image so that they can launch an IPO, and regain its independence again. No one at GM wants the "Goverment Motors" moniker anymore. therei s no one inside, feet up on the desk, looking out the window with a smile on his face because teh goverment has thier back.
GM wants to get out of the line of fire asap. They see Ford's squeeky image since they didnt take any direct bail out funds or owned by the goverment. They want that.
GM will most deffinatly need loans in the future, as they have always have.
Prior to bail outs, GM as well as Ford and Chrysler, has had to rely on banks for funding, as foriegn companies could always go back to thier goverments for help in either funding or regulation.
Now Im not blaming the Japanese or the Europeans for GM's financial demise. GM made mistakes years ago, and it finally came back to haunt them at the worst moment possible.

I cannot imagine GM, with every right wing pundit and political member weeding through financial statements and books trying to find something, pull such a move like that. Maybe its just me. Could there be some fishy stuff going on, Im sure at some level.
Did GM give back money that was loaned to them by the Treasury because they no longer need it? Yes. Was it as clean and easy as they might have made it out to be in the commercial? Probably not, and it never is.

[NastyEllEssWon]

Originally Posted by BigAls87Z28

GM hasnt posted a profit, so that makes no sense either?
Last month, GM sold more cars with 4 brands then they did with 8 a year ago.
There is a 33% gain in Retail sales across the 4 brands.

Everything you have said about GM could easily be said for Ford as well? Ford could just be using the loans from banks to say that they are making money.
That is pure speculation and total ********. The guy should have lost all credability when he said that GM had to sell 17 million cars in order to be profitable. GM, as of 2 years ago, could be profitable if they sold 25% of 15 million total cars sold in the US. To say that GM now has to sell more cars then the current market has been buying is insane, and I take whatever that guy said to you as nonsense.
You dont want to believe me, thats fine. Im just a GM fanboi that has no idea what Im talking about.
GM will just fall apart in 6 months anyway.

considering the brands that gm axed mostly housed sister cars of something that the other 4 already sold only means their business is remaining the same as its been. axe 50 percent of your company, still offering the same products or something similar and gaining 33 percent more business in the other brands is just pushing sales to a more consolidated gm. only thing theyre saving is the extra overhead costs of having 4 extra brands with 1 or 2 unique vehicles.

[BigAls87Z28]

Its a very big drop in expense. It also allows the marketing money to go towards less cars, giving each car more money, IE Camaro's budget is for itself, and not to be shared with a Firebird.

When you look at stats of the dead brands, they have a very very low return rate to not only to GM but to the brand itself. I believe there is a recent report that only 33% of Pontiac owners returned to Pontiac or elsewhere in GM.
Saturn is also very low because for a very long time people didnt realize it was part of GM. When Chevy squashed a lot of development and funds set aside for Saturn, Saturn owners looking to move foward and upwards found nothing.
Hummer and Saab owners are also seen the same, not associating with a GM brand, and just the imagine of that brand. Saab and Hummer has/had a very loyal following, but will not return to GM.

[SteveR]

Originally Posted by BigAls87Z28

All of GM's new cars are selling well, and at high transaction prices and with no rebates.

Now Im not blaming the Japanese or the Europeans for GM's financial demise. GM made mistakes years ago, and it finally came back to haunt them at the worst moment possible.

GM makes a set profit off of each car sold. GM sells them to a distributor who then sells them to the stealerships. High transaction prices only puts more money in the stealership's pockets, not GM's.


GM has only itself to blame for it's financial demise. It was responsible for staying current with the changing demands not only in the domestic market, but in the dominating global market, and GM failed. GM should really take a look at Mercedes. Mercedes looks at markets in various sectors in the world and develops and markets to that sector. You will find MBs all over the place. GM on the other hand develops for bizarre small niche sectors and invests ludicrous dollars into a venture that will maybe break even. Like the CTS-V. LOVE the car, but a TV show paid for by GM on the SPEED Channel about how cool the CTS-V is? How many of them will they have to sell to cover the costs to promote a niche car? Why not promote something with a much larger market interest like oh say the Camaro? Maybe make commercials about diesel trucks?

We now live in a global marketplace and GM needs to adapt, or they won't survive.

[BigAls87Z28]

Id say based on GM's success elsewhere in the world, the problems are secluded to GM North America.
China, GM's joint ventures are raking in tons of money, and China now leads design on future Buicks.
GM Europe, while losing money due to massive amounts of funding for new products, is doing very well with its new Insigna and its new Astra.
Chevy in Europe is also expanding quickly as well. Its one of the fastest growing brands in Europe and China.
And Holden...well Oz's best selling car is a RWD, 2 ton V6 and V8 powered sedans with Lions on the front.
GM's financial problem was not because they were just burning 100's to light thier cigars, they were in the middle of a massive product surge. They were caught with thier pants down due to high labor costs, and banks failing left and right, leaving them no where to turn to for money.
GM had to show off its future products some 3-4 years into the future to the ATF in order to get any money.


GM North America has been its weak spot, and for good reason.