Roll Bar for daily driving - NJFBOA - Home of New Jersey's Camaros and Firebirds

LTb1ow · 12-23-2013, 03:09 PM

Being as I am bored as hell at work, and been reading up on a pure daily driver and roll bars. Lets have at it.

Is there a way to have a roll bar in a say 95% street car and 5% track car with it being safe?

I would think that if you have a quality seat, with the main hoop far back from the seat and seat either braced to bar or a quality braced seat, then have stock seatbelts for daily use and harnesses for track use.. its safe?

A lot of very heated opinions on this, ironic that "street" cars need a bar to run at a NHRA track. But I digress.

Blackbirdws6 · 12-23-2013, 03:16 PM

What do you mean by safe and I assume you are referring to a 6-point? I'm not up on the specific NHRA rules that would pertain to your car.

Featherburner · 12-23-2013, 03:20 PM

Nothing ironic about it.

LTb1ow · 12-23-2013, 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blackbirdws6

What do you mean by safe and I assume you are referring to a 6-point? I'm not up on the specific NHRA rules that would pertain to your car.

Yes, and same as you, I need a 6pt and harness for potential ET or my current trap I believe.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Featherburner

Nothing ironic about it.

A new vette will run off factory floor needing a bar..so the NHRA knows more about crash safety than GM and the DOT..? Ironic to me.

Blackbirdws6 · 12-23-2013, 03:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LTb1ow

Yes, and same as you, I need a 6pt and harness for potential ET or my current trap I believe.

A new vette will run off factory floor needing a bar..so the NHRA knows more about crash safety than GM and the DOT..? Ironic to me.

Well I like my swing outs since I keep them out of the car unless I am headed to the track. I don't know if they are allowed any longer but I didn't get any crap for them this past year.

Featherburner · 12-23-2013, 03:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LTb1ow

A new vette will run off factory floor needing a bar..so the NHRA knows more about crash safety than GM and the DOT..? Ironic to me.

NHRA knows more about racing safety on their tracks than GM and DOT? Yeah, I think so. Ironic, not at all.

sweetbmxrider · 12-23-2013, 04:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LTb1ow

A new vette will run off factory floor needing a bar..so the NHRA knows more about crash safety than GM and the DOT..? Ironic to me.

What is the trap speed? Oh right, double any posted speed limit

Being several feet from a concrete median with any sort of 3000+ pound death machine barreling down next to me, I see there is a difference.

My jeep has a factory roll bar with 3 point seat belts, what's your question again?

LTb1ow · 12-23-2013, 04:54 PM

Nevermind.

WSex · 12-23-2013, 04:58 PM

The roll bar in my car interfered with the belt system. So those had to go bye bye. But it's quite easy to get in an out of the car with the bars.

BarneyMobile · 12-23-2013, 05:05 PM

Matt, your car still won't be NHRA legal with only a 6 point roll bar. A 6 point is only good to 10.0 or 135mph.

BonzoHansen · 12-23-2013, 05:05 PM

fwiw a new vette has a lot more crash protection than a car designed over 20 years ago and then modified. /offtopic

I guess you need to figure out how a much cage needs to be built to pass NHRA rules and then see if it can be installed in such a way that your head cannot come in contact with it in a crash, and that you can leave the 3 points in place as IIRC it is illegal to drive around with a harness on. Assuming this is a bar with door bars and not a full cage. IMO a full cage has no place on the street. I think we sadly saw the consequences of that not too long ago. Of course your back seats are off limits with a bar of any sort.

WildBillyT · 12-23-2013, 05:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LTb1ow

Being as I am bored as hell at work, and been reading up on a pure daily driver and roll bars. Lets have at it.

Is there a way to have a roll bar in a say 95% street car and 5% track car with it being safe?

I would think that if you have a quality seat, with the main hoop far back from the seat and seat either braced to bar or a quality braced seat, then have stock seatbelts for daily use and harnesses for track use.. its safe?

A lot of very heated opinions on this, ironic that "street" cars need a bar to run at a NHRA track. But I digress.

From what I can gather:

1.) Gotta keep the regular seat belts for DOT purposes
2.) Use a quality seat
3.) Don't dick around with mounting the harness
4.) Swing outs are legal, and I *think* you can have them double-pinned, so you can completely remove the door bars for street use.
5.) You may actually be in cage territory, not bar.

FWIW, I'd do it.

WSex · 12-23-2013, 05:08 PM

Well I know the harness is illegal in street because it won't slack. And you're neck goes crrraaaack.

WildBillyT · 12-23-2013, 05:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BonzoHansen

fwiw a new vette has a lot more crash protection than a car designed over 20 years ago and then modified. /offtopic

I guess you need to figure out how a much cage needs to be built to pass NHRA rules and then see if it can be installed in such a way that your head cannot come in contact with it in a crash, and that you can leave the 3 points in place as IIRC it is illegal to drive around with a harness on. Assuming this is a bar with door bars and not a full cage. IMO a full cage has no place on the street. I think we sadly saw the consequences of that not too long ago. Of course your back seats are off limits with a bar of any sort.

Agreed on that. I am assuming he is talking about a 6 pt which would have adequate head clearance.

Like so. The crossbar would be slightly below shoulder height so there's no problem there. Yes, I know the door bars are not legal in this pic.

WildBillyT · 12-23-2013, 05:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WSex

Well I know the harness is illegal in street because it won't slack. And you're neck goes crrraaaack.

What?

BonzoHansen · 12-23-2013, 05:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WSex

Well I know the harness is illegal in street because it won't slack. And you're neck goes crrraaaack.

belts do stretch in accidents, they are deigned that way. but yes harnesses less so. and most street morons install them wrong so they do more harm than good - oooh spinal compression hurts. Plus if you don't have a cage the roof might crush you in a rollover - 3 points actually let you move by design.

WildBillyT · 12-23-2013, 05:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BonzoHansen

belts do stretch in accidents, they are deigned that way. but yes harnesses less so. and most street morons install them wrong so they do more harm than good - oooh spinal compression hurts. Plus if you don't have a cage the roof might crush you in a rollover - 3 points actually let you move by design.

It's amazing how many people mount to the floor.

sweetbmxrider · 12-23-2013, 05:27 PM

There are DOT approved 5 point belts.

My jeep has front spreader bars from the factory with a piece of cloth around it. My seat can recline under the main hoop. I should be wearing a helmet when I drive it with my 3 point belts.

Most newer cars have cinching belts, they pull you tight against the seat, the air bag deploys, you smash your face into the bag, life is good aside from bag burns on your arms and maybe some powder in the eyes.

I'm still wondering what you were talking about with seat depth etc? Sure a flimsy kirkey should be supported by the cross bar but stock seats survive highway wrecks.

In my humble, biased, and mostly incorrect opinion, you either do it right for the track and sacrifice safety on the street or keep it right for the street and sacrifice safety on the track. If you try to do both, neither will be safe.

And Rob is right, you are 10 point halo land brah.

WildBillyT · 12-23-2013, 07:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sweetbmxrider

There are DOT approved 5 point belts.

My jeep has front spreader bars from the factory with a piece of cloth around it. My seat can recline under the main hoop. I should be wearing a helmet when I drive it with my 3 point belts.

Most newer cars have cinching belts, they pull you tight against the seat, the air bag deploys, you smash your face into the bag, life is good aside from bag burns on your arms and maybe some powder in the eyes.

I'm still wondering what you were talking about with seat depth etc? Sure a flimsy kirkey should be supported by the cross bar but stock seats survive highway wrecks.

In my humble, biased, and mostly incorrect opinion, you either do it right for the track and sacrifice safety on the street or keep it right for the street and sacrifice safety on the track. If you try to do both, neither will be safe.

And Rob is right, you are 10 point halo land brah.

If you are talking about the Schroth belts, yeah, but they have to be mounted in the stock belt mount areas from what I remember. Or something like that, there's a technicality.

Dudbird113 · 12-23-2013, 07:36 PM

If i was you id go track oriented setup. Either way a cage or roll bar=killer lol

LTb1ow · 12-23-2013, 07:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sweetbmxrider

There are DOT approved 5 point belts.

My jeep has front spreader bars from the factory with a piece of cloth around it. My seat can recline under the main hoop. I should be wearing a helmet when I drive it with my 3 point belts.

Most newer cars have cinching belts, they pull you tight against the seat, the air bag deploys, you smash your face into the bag, life is good aside from bag burns on your arms and maybe some powder in the eyes.

I'm still wondering what you were talking about with seat depth etc? Sure a flimsy kirkey should be supported by the cross bar but stock seats survive highway wrecks.

In my humble, biased, and mostly incorrect opinion, you either do it right for the track and sacrifice safety on the street or keep it right for the street and sacrifice safety on the track. If you try to do both, neither will be safe.

And Rob is right, you are 10 point halo land brah.

This is the point of the thread basically.

Obviously I need a bar of some sorts but I daily drive the car for the most part so making it so the bar doesn't kill me in a accident round town, how would you do it.

I think a pure 100% NHRA passing bar is not that paramount, as most of the tech I have seen at T&T nights/rentals is nonexistent.

sweetbmxrider · 12-23-2013, 08:40 PM

Don't put anything in it and take the gamble at the track or throw something in it and take the gamble on the street. I drive my car and don't think twice about it. Like I mentioned, my jeep has a roll bar that I could easily smash my head into. Its actually worse than my car and it rolled off of the assembly line like that.

Dudbird113 · 12-23-2013, 08:55 PM

Let me ask you this, what is the intent of your car?

LTb1ow · 12-23-2013, 09:13 PM

A car I can race at the track without worrying about slamming the brakes at the 1/8 and also daily drive making sure I make the bar so that its safe.

Dudbird113 · 12-23-2013, 10:13 PM

For how fast you should go i think cage is in order. I see no reason why you wouldnt be safe on the street with a full cage with a swing out bar. Seat and belt wise idk about. You could leave the bars in the door if your worried alot.