Street Racing??

[unstable bob gable]

Originally Posted by BonzoHansen

It's not just planning. The mere lack of response to it is tantamount to implicit approval. Go ask the Dean at Rider what he thinks about this concept. He just got hit with CRIMINAL CHARGES over the binge drinking death of that kid last March. And that is on top of the civil lawsuit by the family - which Rider will likely pay dearly.

Why? Basically, the University did not do enough to stop it. He wasn't there. He said he is against it. The University had rules against it (as does the state). But there he is in court. Bull? Sure. But Rider has the deep pockets to defend him. Last I looked, Tim & Justin do not. And that is the point you are missing.

Will it ever happen? Probably not. But I sure wouldn't want to be around if it were to happen. And I sure wouldn't want to trust the legal reasoning purposed by some guys on the internet.

Generally, all I see here is a lot of talk from people who have nothing personally on the line here. I see people who want what they want - and how it potentially impacts others matters not. Nice. Go to a site the allows it, or better yet ante up for your own forum if you want to do it. Until then, those are the rules and the reasons behind them.

BRICKA! BRACKA!
FIRECRACKA...
Oh, never mind...

[BonzoHansen]

Originally Posted by unstable bob gable

BRICKA! BRACKA!
FIRECRACKA...
Oh, never mind...

LOL

[WayFast84]

Originally Posted by BonzoHansen

It's not just planning. The mere lack of response to it is tantamount to implicit approval. Go ask the Dean at Rider what he thinks about this concept. He just got hit with CRIMINAL CHARGES over the binge drinking death of that kid last March. And that is on top of the civil lawsuit by the family - which Rider will likely pay dearly.

Why? Basically, the University did not do enough to stop it. He wasn't there. He said he is against it. The University had rules against it (as does the state). But there he is in court. Bull? Sure. But Rider has the deep pockets to defend him. Last I looked, Tim & Justin do not. And that is the point you are missing.

Will it ever happen? Probably not. But I sure wouldn't want to be around if it were to happen. And I sure wouldn't want to trust the legal reasoning purposed by some guys on the internet.

Generally, all I see here is a lot of talk from people who have nothing personally on the line here. I see people who want what they want - and how it potentially impacts others matters not. Nice. Go to a site the allows it, or better yet ante up for your own forum if you want to do it. Until then, those are the rules and the reasons behind them.

thats a real good post about the topic

[bad64chevelle]

Originally Posted by qwikz28

you did in my car


dick

Hey, its all good...what can I say the car was moving that night 111.8 MPH on a 13.41 run, ya can bet yer butt I was sideways most of that run. Why do you think that dude in the Mustang didnt want to line up with me again

i do understand where your coming from but at the same time... has Tech been sued for it? which you mentioned is much larger then this site therefore many more people to be offended or effected by it. i do see your point about people setting up races and what not and i agree that it shouldnt be allowed. but almost every site i go on has a section for Kill stories. i dont see the problem with that. can you elaborate on that a little for me? (not being a smartass)

[Mike]

personally i think tim has been going above and beyond with actually stating reasons and logic (as much as timmay has) behind his decisions....what it boils down to is that Tim (njspeeder) and justin (tru2chevy) literally OWN this website. the only thing they have to tell you is......"we dont want street racing discussed, end of story" and they can pull it down.

while i understand that a lot of sites have sections for kill stories, those sites also have to deal with the bullpoop that goes on in them, many turn into arguments, fights, pissing matches, and worst of all BENCH RACING by a bunch of people that werent there or have never seen either car.

no one is getting all holier-than-thow and preaching to you NOT to street race, we are asking NOT to post about it. no one can tell you what you should go out and do, but they can tell you what you can post about in a privately owned site.

/rant, off to the nats.

[BonzoHansen]

Originally Posted by 86Formula

i do understand where your coming from but at the same time... has Tech been sued for it? which you mentioned is much larger then this site therefore many more people to be offended or effected by it. i do see your point about people setting up races and what not and i agree that it shouldnt be allowed. but almost every site i go on has a section for Kill stories. i dont see the problem with that. can you elaborate on that a little for me? (not being a smartass)

I dunno, a lot of the site I frequent (like Team Camaro, NastyZ28, Pro-Touring, Lateral-G) do not allow s/r or kill stories.

Your question "has Tech been sued" is not the point. I point back to my reply:

"Will it ever happen? Probably not. But I sure wouldn't want to be around if it were to happen. And I sure wouldn't want to trust the legal reasoning purposed by some guys on the internet."

What is more to elaborate?

Again, are you going to ante up the thousands in legal costs if it were to happen? I serisouly doubt it.

[NJSPEEDER]

Originally Posted by 86Formula

but almost every site i go on has a section for Kill stories. i dont see the problem with that. can you elaborate on that a little for me? (not being a smartass)

several possible reasons

1: they have deep enough ockets to defend themselves
2: they don't understand how they can be liable
3: they don't care how they can be liable

i have no answers for how other forums and clubs deal with it. i do talk to many other owners, admins, and mods, but this is a topic area that i have never discussed with them.

even though the likelyhood of a legal recourse is minimal, it is something we can't afford personally. it also does nothing to advance the club or the hobby, so there really isn't any redeeming value to allowing it either.

[Noodles]

i knew it couldnt have been the sponsors...

[98tadriver]

Originally Posted by NJSPEEDER

regadless of whether we say we don't approve of street racing or not we can be held legally liable if races are planned using our forums. who does or doesn't approve of street racing has nothing to do with who can get sued for it.
our intention is not to change anyone's outlook or the ways in which they enjoy their car and the hobby. at the same time we have to look at things from the perspective of what is best for the club and hobby as a whole. getting my pants sued off woudl be a very bad thing for the club since i can barely afford to do this as it is, much less after having to hire a lawyer.

Who said we're gonnna use njfboa to plan our illegal races? i dont. Whats the harm in sharing kill stories? If i want to call a person out, i will either tell em personally, get their phone number and call them or use AIM. Bahhhh just make a street racing and kill story section, and put a disclaimer and some rules there.

Its kinda hard not to street race people when the nearest drag strip is 1 hour away. and on top of that when people blow up or leak oil (which they do 90% of the time when i go), i only get 2 runs from 530pm until 1030pm. thats a waste of gas and drag radial for that 50 mile trip one way. As with anything, youre taking a risk when you race;
I cut down those obvious risks that the stupid ricer kids dont- I dont race where there's houses or intersections. its definately not busy with traffic, if any car at all, and my exhaust scares away deer and any other woodland creature within a 1 mile radius.

[NJSPEEDER]

you are missing the point ron, a disclaimer doesn't mean anything legally. we are still liable. point blank, no way around it.

who says you would use the forum to plan races? hmmm, talk about where to meet up, talk about what goes on in those spots, and brag about the resulting races. yeah, no lawyer or cop woudl ever figure something that obvious out.

also, how does you bragging about breaking the law do any good for the club, the hobby, or young enthusiasts trying to learn the right way to do things? for that matter what good does it do you considering we have already mentioned that there are police who are opposed to street racing that cruise the board?

there is no upside to allowing street racing and kill stories on our forum. there are enough other places on the web for you to talk about it, i invite you to check out those forums if you want to talk about illegal racing. i will not allow a club that so many people have put so much effort into to be taken down because some people don't want to do things the legal and safe way. it ranges from the negative image of the membership created all the way through possible legal actions against the club, justin, and myself.

btw, you missed a great opportunity to race for money legally and safely today at the east coast nats. great weather, lots of laughs, and a few hundred enthusiasts all out enjoying a beautiful summer day at the track.

[Squirrel]

just do what i do, ive been involved in a couple street races that took place in mexico set up via PM
easy...

[wrong generation]

Originally Posted by 98tadriver

Its kinda hard not to street race people when the nearest drag strip is 1 hour away. and on top of that when people blow up or leak oil (which they do 90% of the time when i go), i only get 2 runs from 530pm until 1030pm. thats a waste of gas and drag radial for that 50 mile trip one way. As with anything, youre taking a risk when you race;
I cut down those obvious risks that the stupid ricer kids dont- I dont race where there's houses or intersections. its definately not busy with traffic, if any car at all, and my exhaust scares away deer and any other woodland creature within a 1 mile radius.

exactly my point

[qwikz28]

the problem is that your point is not valid. if you lost control and hit a friend or family member of mine street racing because you are too lazy then i would only hope the judge would through the book at you. it may seem very unlikely to you, and you're right. it is. but there is a chance, and thats why it shouldnt happen.

[Squirrel]

Originally Posted by qwikz28

the problem is that your point is not valid. if you lost control and hit a friend or family member of mine street racing because you are too lazy then i would only hope the judge would through the book at you. it may seem very unlikely to you, and you're right. it is. but there is a chance, and thats why it shouldnt happen.

::waiting for the "yeah, but that could happen at the track too."::

but i know i'd rather be racing a street car on an open highway instead of gettin freight trained by an 8 second bracket car on slicks/skinnies on the track

[BonzoHansen]

Again, what the hell is so hard to understand? If we allow the posting of kill videos and street racing realted threads, it can be seen as implicit approval and support, and therefore open the site owners up for liability issues. Again, I refer to the current case at Rider. That is how the law works.

If you don't think a 19 year old facing vehicular manslaughter charges wouldn’t say “I was encouraged to race by videos I saw online” in order to cut a deal with a prosecutor, then you are at best surprisingly naïve. Any pubic official would happily offer a lesser charge for one guy in exchange for multiple charges against more people in an attempt to publicly appear to be attacking aggressive driving. Welcome to the real world. Your ride will be very bumpy if you don’t wake up to certain realities.

To echo Jake, to say the track is too far away to use is a tremendously poor argument. It makes zero logical sense. That doesn’t make street racing ok. And more importantly it does not mitigate the liability issues here (that is the big complaint here, right, the club’s rule?). It means there are not enough tracks or you need to move closer to a track. If that is your best argument, then use all this energy to go work on solving one of those issues.

If you truly think we are wrong, then open your wallet and start your own forum. Stop being interweb mouths and go put your neck on the line. Yeah, I didn’t think so.

[Jersey_TA]

Originally Posted by NJSPEEDER

regadless of whether we say we don't approve of street racing or not we can be held legally liable if races are planned using our forums. who does or doesn't approve of street racing has nothing to do with who can get sued for it.
our intention is not to change anyone's outlook or the ways in which they enjoy their car and the hobby. at the same time we have to look at things from the perspective of what is best for the club and hobby as a whole. getting my pants sued off woudl be a very bad thing for the club since i can barely afford to do this as it is, much less after having to hire a lawyer.

So if we set up races at atco using this site and heaven forbid someone crashes during that race at the track they can just come on here and sue you too???

ugh not woth arguing since it won't make any difference. So does this mean all my TR posts in the future are going to be deleted?

[Pampered-Z]

Oh for god sakes why can't you all stop these stupid post about street racing! The rules Tim set for this site are clear. So if you don't like them why are you here?

People complain about others asked or posting dumb stuff yet the lounge is full of "why can't I post about street racing". BECAUSE IT'S NOT ALLOWED!

If you know of other sites that allow those type of post and you want to post then just go do it on those sites!

End of rant!

[BonzoHansen]

Originally Posted by Jersey_TA

So if we set up races at atco using this site and heaven forbid someone crashes during that race at the track they can just come on here and sue you too???

Not really the same situation. Racing at a track is legal. You also have to sign a court-proven waiver at the track, I believe you have to be 18, and you have to use required safety gear, pass tech, etc. None of that applies here. It is just like skiing. There is an inherent level of risk that you accept when you pay for your lift ticket. That has been held up in court many times. To me, that is a much cleaner analogy.

I know this was more of a rhetorical statement, but I am sure other members may ask this too.

[WildBillyT]

Originally Posted by Jersey_TA

So if we set up races at atco using this site and heaven forbid someone crashes during that race at the track they can just come on here and sue you too???

ugh not woth arguing since it won't make any difference. So does this mean all my TR posts in the future are going to be deleted?

Of course not.

But if someone does something illegal (be it street racing or crack dealing) and they talk about it on here we will be dragged into it.

Not to mention that cops lurk here looking for posts about street racing.

[PolarBear]

Originally Posted by BonzoHansen

If you truly think we are wrong, then open your wallet and start your own forum. Stop being interweb mouths and go put your neck on the line. Yeah, I didn’t think so.

[Jersey_TA]

Originally Posted by WildBillyT

Of course not.

But if someone does something illegal (be it street racing or crack dealing) and they talk about it on here we will be dragged into it.

Not to mention that cops lurk here looking for posts about street racing.

not like the NJ cops can do anything about my IL racing and vids I posted...were deleted. I didn't know this post even existed since I haven't been on much since being home. I wouldn't have posted them if I knew.

[BonzoHansen]

That's cool, it is kind of a new thing. That is why I sent you the PM.

[Jersey_TA]

Originally Posted by BonzoHansen

That's cool, it is kind of a new thing. That is why I sent you the PM.

Thanks for the heads up.

[WildBillyT]

Originally Posted by Jersey_TA

not like the NJ cops can do anything about my IL racing and vids I posted...were deleted. I didn't know this post even existed since I haven't been on much since being home. I wouldn't have posted them if I knew.

Not exactly what I meant...

If you line up a race on Rt 37 for thursday night and a lurking PD sees it he can/will check you out. If it sounds far-fetched, it isn't- other boards have "keep places/times secret" disclaimers on them for that reason. Smallblockposse.com's banner is a prime example.

Does that make more sense? It's been a long day...