Obama vs. Clinton

[johnjzjz]

Originally Posted by Ian

perhaps I should have worded my first statement better and excluded the Mexican war part. I was referring to acts of terrorism. unprovoked, non-military attacks.

the revolutionary war was just that, a war. pearl harbor was a military installation that was attacked by another country's military. As Al already said, the Lusitania was a British ship that was sunk off the coast of Ireland. By no means am I trying to down play the importance of any of these events, but they are not "terrorist" attacks. They are all acts of war.


I also do not appreciate being talked down to. Yeah, I'm young and no, I've never been in combat but that does not make me any less of a person. You're also very quick to label me a liberal when you know nothing of my views.

I also do not appreciate being talked down to. < i do apologize if thats how you took that - it was not meant the way i guess it was written and being young is an advantage - being a geaser like i am lets me be a bastard and not care at the time i do it -

had you not in another post called yourself a liberal i would not have made that assumption on my own

no excuses -- ME pointing out bad behavior to explain other bad behavior is just dumb - jz

[Ian]

I called myself a liberal? jeez, I should watch what I say

I voted for a republican in the primaries.

[qwikz28]

well... in case you don't care about politics and want to get involved, here is a list i found on ls1tech of the candidates and what they claim to drive.

DEMS--
Joe Biden: No Response
Chris Dodd: Ford Escape Hybrid
John Edwards: Ford Escape Hybrid (2007)
Mike Gravel: No Response
Dennis Kucinich: No Response
Barack Obama: Chrysler 300
Bill Richardson: No Response
Hillary Clinton: No Response

REPUBS--
Rudy Guiliani: An aide reported that he doesn't own a car
Mike Huckabee: Chevrolet Tahoe Flexfuel (2007)
Duncan Hunter: Chevrolet Suburban (1987) [Year not a typo]
John McCain: Cadillac CTS
Ron Paul: Lincoln Town Car, Buick Skylark
Mitt Romney: Ford Mustang Convertible (2005), AMC Rambler (1962)
Fred Thompson: "Volvo SUV"

ps- thread also said that Mccain used to have a nasty blown 4th gen TA. don't know if anyone has heard that before

[PBodyGT87]

I'm going to try to explain the issue with health care, nicely, and with a little more detail on the issue.

That is correct, Europe puts patients on a waiting list for free health care. Patients with minor injuries or heath issues can be taken care of quickly, however, something like cancer treatment gets the waiting list. Cancer patients are more likely to suffer and die before they get treatment there, so they come over here. Now, the US charges an awful lot, but you get immediate treatment. Why is the treatment so expensive? Well, for one we allow our country to sue the medical system for millions, thanks to our greedy lawyers. In Europe, if they make a mistake, oh well, it was free. But here, our medical system is constantly getting sued for millions and millions of dollars, for what? To bring someone back from the dead? The more they make mistakes, the more we sue, the more money they lose, the more money it costs. Now, Hillary would like to mandate health care. This is a very difficult thing to try to do because no matter how cheap we make the lowest form of health care, what that person pays for their low cost insurance still gets taxed so much that it negates the low cost. :Flower: Unless we make health care free, it will never be low cost so long as it is immediate. McCain offers not to tax what you pay in bills, which saves a few thousand dollars on each 5 or 10 thousand dollar bill. And currently, if you are without heath care, and you go to the hospital, you can fill out some papers and the state of New Jersey will take care of at least 50% of the bill, and most of the rest the hospital doesn't charge the uninsured for under their special funding programs, which cuts the bill down to almost nothing. It's a lot cheaper for someone without health insurance to pay a 15,000 dollar bill having it cut down to 2,000 than to pay for yearly health insurance that would be taxed anyway.

[qwikz28]

liz, clinton just said she does not want to mandate health care. i don't get it

[Knipps]

No wonder Romney's got UBG's vote

[bubba428]

Originally Posted by qwikz28

liz, clinton just said she does not want to mandate health care. i don't get it

Shes a LIAR, not that they all aren't. shes just blatantly obvious about it

[BigAls87Z28]

I dont think she will MANDATE healthcare, but she want to make healthcare more affordable.

[Icemansghost]

From: those of us who spent time in the military, believe in our military and support the men and women of our military, read on............. ~
John Glenn (DEMOCRAT) said this ----- It should make you think a little:

There were 39 combat related killings in Iraq in January.
In the fair city of Detroit there were 35 murders in the
month of January. That's just one American city,
about as deadly as the entire war-torn country of Iraq .

When some claim that President Bush shouldn't
have started this war, state the following:


FDR (DEMOCRAT) led us into World War II.

Germany never attacked us ; Japan did.
From 1941-1945, 450,000 lives were lost ...
an aver age of 112,500 per year.



Truman (DEMOCRAT) finished that war and started one in Korea
North Korea never attacked us
From 1950-1953, 55,000 lives were lost .
an average of 18,334 per year.

John F. Kennedy (DEMOCRAT) started the Vietnam conflict in 1962.
Vietnam never attacked us.

Johnson ( DEMOCRAT) turned Vietnam into a quagmire.
From 1965-1975, 58,000 lives were lost
an average of 5,800 per year.

Clinton (DEMOCRAT) went to war in Bosnia without UN or French consent.
Bosnia never attacked us.
He was offered Osama bin Laden's head on a platter three
times by Sudan and did nothing. Osama has attacked us on
multiple occasions.

In the years since terrorists attacked us , President Bush
has liberated two countries, crushed the Taliban, crippled
al-Qaida, put nuclear inspectors in Libya , Iran , and, North Korea without firing a shot, and captured a terrorist who slaughtered 300,000 of his own people. And the Democrats are complaining about how long the war is taking.

But Wait, There's more!

It took less time to take Iraq than it took Janet Reno (DEMOCRAT)
to take the Branch Davidian compound.
That was a 51-day operation..


Isn't she a sight???
We've been looking for evidence for chemical weapons
in Iraq for less time than it took Hillary Clinton (DEMOCRAT) to find
the Rose Law Firm billing records.







It took less time for the 3rd Infantry Division and the
Marines to destroy the Medina Republican Guard
than it took Ted Kennedy to call the police after his
Oldsmobile sank at Chappaquiddick.

It took less time to take Iraq than it took
to count the votes in Florida !!!



Our Commander-In-Chief is doing a GREAT JOB !
The Military morale is high!

The biased media hopes we are too ignorant
to realize the facts

But Wait

There's more!


JOHN GLENN (on the Senate floor - January 26, 2004)

Some people still don't understand why military personnel
do what they do for a living. This exchange between
Senators John Glenn and Senator Howard Metzenbaum
is worth reading. Not only is it a pretty impressiv e
impromptu speech, but it's also a good example of one
man's explanation of why men and women in the armed
services do what they do for a living.

This IS a typical, though sad, example of what
some who have never served think of the military.

Senator Metzenbaum (speaking to Senator Glenn):
'How can you run for Senate when you've never held a real job?'

Senator Glenn (D-Ohio):
'I served 23 years in the United States Marine Corps.
I served through two wars. I flew 149 missions.
My plane was hit by anti-aircraft fire on 12 different
occasi ons. I was in the space program. It wasn't my
checkbook, Howard; it was my life on the line. It was
not a nine-to-five job, where I took time off t o take the
daily cash receipts to the bank.'

'I ask you to go with me .. . as I went the other day...
to a veteran's hospital and look those men ...
with their mangled bodies . in the eye, and tell THEM
they didn't hold a job!


You go with me to the Space Program at NASA
and go, as I have gone, to the widows and Orphans
of Ed White, Gus Grissom and Roger Chaffee...
and you look those kids in the eye and tell them
that their DAD'S didn't hold a job.



You go with me on Memorial Day and you stand in
Arlington National Cemetery , where I have more friends
buried than I'd like to remember, and you watch
those waving flags.
You stand there, and you think about this nation,
and you have the gall to tell ME that those people didn't have a job?

What about Metzenbaum?'

For those who don't r emember
During W.W.II, Howard Metzenbaum was an attorney
representing the Communist Party in the USA

Now he's a Senator!

If you can read this, thank a teacher.
If you are reading it in English thank a Veteran.



It might not be a bad idea to keep this circulating. I AM!!!

[WildBillyT]

Originally Posted by Buoniconti81

Our Commander-In-Chief is doing a GREAT JOB !
The Military morale is high!

You had me reading up until this part. He is not doing a fine job, and the general feeling amongst most Americans proves it. There is more to being a good president and good leader than national security and military strength.

[Savage_Messiah]

Originally Posted by Buoniconti81

There were 39 combat related killings in Iraq in January.
In the fair city of Detroit there were 35 murders in the
month of January. That's just one American city,
about as deadly as the entire war-torn country of Iraq .

So why are we more concerned with ensuring Iraqi safety then bettering our own country?

FDR (DEMOCRAT) led us into World War II.

Germany never attacked us ; Japan did.
From 1941-1945, 450,000 lives were lost ...
an aver age of 112,500 per year.

If we hadn't gotten involved in WW2 the Axis would have finished takign europe, and we'd probably be speaking German right now.

Truman (DEMOCRAT) finished that war and started one in Korea
North Korea never attacked us
From 1950-1953, 55,000 lives were lost .
an average of 18,334 per year.

Communist North Korea invaded South Korea, and the UN voted to support S. Korea and send in troops. We happened to send in the most.

John F. Kennedy (DEMOCRAT) started the Vietnam conflict in 1962.
Vietnam never attacked us.

Fair. We tryed to play police and "fix" another coutry... and didn't learn our lesson.

Johnson ( DEMOCRAT) turned Vietnam into a quagmire.
From 1965-1975, 58,000 lives were lost
an average of 5,800 per year.

the whole thing was a quagmire, and Johnson shoulda withdrew much much sooner and cut our losses

Clinton (DEMOCRAT) went to war in Bosnia without UN or French consent.
Bosnia never attacked us.

Eh? Then remind me why there were UN troops there? And why NATO was actively involved in the war as well?

Bosnia was torn in civil war... make up your mind, is stopping war crimes, crimes against humanity and genocide good or bad?

He was offered Osama bin Laden's head on a platter three
times by Sudan and did nothing. Osama has attacked us on
multiple occasions.

When did he attack us before 1998?

In the years since terrorists attacked us , President Bush
has liberated two countries, crushed the Taliban, crippled
al-Qaida, put nuclear inspectors in Libya , Iran , and, North Korea without firing a shot, and captured a terrorist who slaughtered 300,000 of his own people. And the Democrats are complaining about how long the war is taking.

What countries has he liberated? By liberated, I mean are stable now and will remain so if we withdraw our troops. And OK, we got Saddam, but what about bil Laden, the one who actually attacked us?

But Wait, There's more!

It took less time to take Iraq than it took Janet Reno (DEMOCRAT)
to take the Branch Davidian compound.
That was a 51-day operation..


Isn't she a sight???
We've been looking for evidence for chemical weapons
in Iraq for less time than it took Hillary Clinton (DEMOCRAT) to find
the Rose Law Firm billing records.







It took less time for the 3rd Infantry Division and the
Marines to destroy the Medina Republican Guard
than it took Ted Kennedy to call the police after his
Oldsmobile sank at Chappaquiddick.

It took less time to take Iraq than it took
to count the votes in Florida !!!

WE STILL HAVEN'T TAKEN IRAQ

Our Commander-In-Chief is doing a GREAT JOB !
The Military morale is high!

The biased media hopes we are too ignorant
to realize the facts

Now I'm not sure abotu the military morale, but what's Bush's approval rating right now?

But Wait

There's more!


JOHN GLENN (on the Senate floor - January 26, 2004)

Some people still don't understand why military personnel
do what they do for a living. This exchange between
Senators John Glenn and Senator Howard Metzenbaum
is worth reading. Not only is it a pretty impressiv e
impromptu speech, but it's also a good example of one
man's explanation of why men and women in the armed
services do what they do for a living.

This IS a typical, though sad, example of what
some who have never served think of the military.

Senator Metzenbaum (speaking to Senator Glenn):
'How can you run for Senate when you've never held a real job?'

Senator Glenn (D-Ohio):
'I served 23 years in the United States Marine Corps.
I served through two wars. I flew 149 missions.
My plane was hit by anti-aircraft fire on 12 different
occasi ons. I was in the space program. It wasn't my
checkbook, Howard; it was my life on the line. It was
not a nine-to-five job, where I took time off t o take the
daily cash receipts to the bank.'

'I ask you to go with me .. . as I went the other day...
to a veteran's hospital and look those men ...
with their mangled bodies . in the eye, and tell THEM
they didn't hold a job!


You go with me to the Space Program at NASA
and go, as I have gone, to the widows and Orphans
of Ed White, Gus Grissom and Roger Chaffee...
and you look those kids in the eye and tell them
that their DAD'S didn't hold a job.



You go with me on Memorial Day and you stand in
Arlington National Cemetery , where I have more friends
buried than I'd like to remember, and you watch
those waving flags.
You stand there, and you think about this nation,
and you have the gall to tell ME that those people didn't have a job?

What about Metzenbaum?'

For those who don't r emember
During W.W.II, Howard Metzenbaum was an attorney
representing the Communist Party in the USA

Now he's a Senator!

If you can read this, thank a teacher.
If you are reading it in English thank a Veteran.

That is COMPLETELY unrelated to the rest of the e-mail, and I completely agree with this part.

It might not be a bad idea to keep this circulating. I AM!!!

It might not be a bad idea to do some research before you go sending chain e-mails everywhere.

[Frosty]

Originally Posted by BigAls87Z28

I dont think she will MANDATE healthcare, but she want to make healthcare more affordable.

Read the transcripts from her speeches, if she's saying she won't mandate healthcare now she's a boldfaced liar.

[zuuhlsT/A]

You should read the book Liberal Fascism by Jonah Goldberg. You will find some frightening similarities between what the Democrates are pushing for thats the same as the Nazi's and Fascists pushed for!! Bloody scary!!! Vote Republican !!!!!

[Frosty]

Originally Posted by zuuhlsT/A

You should read the book Liberal Fascism by Jonah Goldberg.

I was going to pick that up next month. Glenn Beck had him on a few times last week, some scary info.

[johnjzjz]

Buoniconti81 < for the few of us who have been their we were taught respect for the office of the president and our superiors, who hold your life in the balance ( truth has a different meaning ) than a collage student -- you cant convince the young who have been brain washed by the 60s generation communist professors ( hippie morons who hate America and anything it stands for ) who have done their job well BTW with what you and I and lots of others see goes on when you try to have an open discussion about politics -- shame -- the puppet talk we always seem to get in a discussion like this they wont believe the moral in the service is at an all time high and reenlistment is also through the roof so to speak, it all falls on deaf ears they only see what the poison left has and continues to show them as truth, Mis Clinton will throw all of the military out of the VA system to achieve her health care program, because all the illegals will be serviced by the than government system, and as a voting block we mean nothing compared to them < truth be told --amnesty was it she said - she is a communist for sure and we as veterans mean nothing to those people its only sound bites when they speak about us to the drive by far left liberal media who in truth despise us as well - just remember ( LRB ) love respect & brotherhood -- 101st airborne -- jz

[Knipps]

Originally Posted by johnjzjz

than a collage student -- you cant convince the young who have been brain washed by the 60s generation communist professors ( hippie morons who hate America and anything it stands for )

what the hell are you talking about...

[Frosty]

John, while me and you agree on most things just because someone is young doesn't mean they're brainwashed. Just because someone doesn't agree with the current administration doesn't mean they're brainwashed. I'm a Republican, I voted for Bush both times but that doesn't mean I don't think he's a moron. Just because he and his people are our superiors doesn't mean they're not above being questioned. I've noticed that the hardcore right thinks that they're boy can't be questioned. Screw that. NOBODY is above having their actions questioned. I will NOT blindly follow someone because they're part of the party I subscribe to(same idea with my religious beliefs but that's another discussion for another time). No President is above the law whether it be Bush Jr, Clinton, Bush Sr etc. To blindly follow a person or an idea without question is very irresponsible.

[bubba428]

indeed....I'm 20, and theres no way in hell i would belive the crap people try to push in the media

[johnjzjz]

Originally Posted by Frosty

John, while me and you agree on most things just because someone is young doesn't mean they're brainwashed. Just because someone doesn't agree with the current administration doesn't mean they're brainwashed. I'm a Republican, I voted for Bush both times but that doesn't mean I don't think he's a moron. Just because he and his people are our superiors doesn't mean they're not above being questioned. I've noticed that the hardcore right thinks that they're boy can't be questioned. Screw that. NOBODY is above having their actions questioned. I will NOT blindly follow someone because they're part of the party I subscribe to(same idea with my religious beliefs but that's another discussion for another time). No President is above the law whether it be Bush Jr, Clinton, Bush Sr etc. To blindly follow a person or an idea without question is very irresponsible.

i also don't agree with 1/2 of what bush has done for sure - i as well voted for him twice and bite my tongue after writing that but -

its not that the guys are young, its that they are young, they are easily swayed that gets me -- again i'm in a i cant make it clear --

i don't believe any politician - first they are all lawyers and are taught the truth is what you need people to believe at all cost - and so their is none

and i am for accountability but its not an English word in government today - jz

[Frosty]

Originally Posted by johnjzjz

and i am for accountability but its not an English word in government today - jz

So true man, so true....

[Knipps]

nader's running again...

[Tru2Chevy]

Originally Posted by Knipps

nader's running again...

Nader has run in every presidential election for the past 3 decades I think....

- Justin

[BonzoHansen]

If anyone notices ralphie joined, that could muck it up just enough for Bloomberg to make his move.

[johnjzjz]

about health care - jz

http://www.freemarketcure.com/brainsurgery.php

[BonzoHansen]

I don't know the right answer for HC, but I do not believe free market is it. You can't price shop for HC. If you're having a heart attack, are you going to ask 3 docs how much 1st? No.

I also know some Canadians who are not enchanted with their HC system. It's a very difficult issue.